Michael Moore's Letter To George W. Bush

[Fleet 500]

Isn't it funny how bush can invade a country but can't help one of his own states out when in need, They have to ask for help then he gets permission to go in.

He has helped... once he was asked, he sent thousands of troops and National Guards into New Orleans.
This is why we have governors and mayors- because a President can't keep track of what's going on in every city and town in the U.S. When there is some kind of emergency, whether it's an earthquake, tornado, flood, riot, etc., the governor and/or mayor is supposed to determine when outside help is needed. The fact that the governor and mayor of N.O. did a bad job in that department is not Bush's fault.

[Matra et Alpine]

About the 'help' beign asked/offered.

THAT is supposed to be part of the reason for VAST SUMS being given to FEMA.
Looks like lots of money went in for little work getting done for preparedness.
Coudl it be possible that FEMA/HomeSecurity is the UN of the USA ?

[SlickHolden]

He has helped... once he was asked, he sent thousands of troops and National Guards into New Orleans.
This is why we have governors and mayors- because a President can't keep track of what's going on in every city and town in the U.S. When there is some kind of emergency, whether it's an earthquake, tornado, flood, riot, etc., the governor and/or mayor is supposed to determine when outside help is needed. The fact that the governor and mayor of N.O. did a bad job in that department is not Bush's fault.

A couple of things.
1. I never said he didn't help.
2. When is it time to just step in and help? When 10 are dead or when 100's are feared dead and there is a crisis at hand?. Anyone with half a brain wouldn't wait till a little old lady that has fell over and hurt herself ask to be helped, You would just do it.
And as i said he waits for noone no permission no help ask to invades a country but can't jump to the ad of one of his own states without permission. At a time of crisis it beats the shit out of me.
He should have been on the phone and jumped in. Something in that way has got to change and it's not bush's fault the system is stuffed up in that way.

But if it's not bush's fault why does he keep taking responsibility for everything?

[Dino Scuderia]

Meanwhile the mayor of New Orleans is calling for people to come back to their homes with it still being a toxic dangerous place, and while the next hurricane, Rita, is brewing and is on a path which could dump large amounts of rain on the city. Corp of Engineers says the levee is not healthy by any means. FEMA is constantly sending health warnings about N.O. in the midst of all this.

In short, it doesn't matter what plans are in place or what resources are available when the powers that be are making irrational decisions. So far there isn't a plan for evacuation/rescue if needed when/if Rita causes havoc. "Nonessential' oil workers in the gulf have been sent home and prices spiked today because of it. The supply is still a bit fragile...

[Fleet 500]

2. When is it time to just step in and help? When 10 are dead or when 100's are feared dead and there is a crisis at hand?. Anyone with half a brain wouldn't wait till a little old lady that has fell over and hurt herself ask to be helped, You would just do it.

Again, when the mayor and/or governor asks for help.
Of course if the mayor/governor did their jobs...

[SlickHolden]

Again, when the mayor and/or governor asks for help.
Of course if the mayor/governor did their jobs...

But still when it's a disaster and the world has herd it's coming why is it that he can't just step in and help. no matter how things are run with gov's and mayors when people family or strangers are in trouble you just get in and help out, If you can't look after your own in trouble why bother at all.
Maybe there has got to be something done if the president can't help without permission when his country is a need then why have one

[Fleet 500]

But still when it's a disaster and the world has herd it's coming why is it that he can't just step in and help. no matter how things are run with gov's and mayors when people family or strangers are in trouble you just get in and help out, If you can't look after your own in trouble why bother at all.
Maybe there has got to be something done if the president can't help without permission when his country is a need then why have one

As I already explained, a mayor and/or governor has to ask for help, being much more informed of happenings during a disaster.
But don't forget... Bush did declare Louisiana and Mississippi disaster areas 24 hours before the hurricane made landfall- the first time a President has done that. And Bush did ask the mayor of N.O. if he needed help and the mayor waited 24 hours before he said he did.

[SlickHolden]

As I already explained, a mayor and/or governor has to ask for help, being much more informed of happenings during a disaster.
But don't forget... Bush did declare Louisiana and Mississippi disaster areas 24 hours before the hurricane made landfall- the first time a President has done that. And Bush did ask the mayor of N.O. if he needed help and the mayor waited 24 hours before he said he did.

And then he waiting 24 hours after the disaster?
Why offer just help. And don't get me wrong and think i don't understand what you have said about the mayors and gov's waiting to check the damage of what has happen, And then the President waiting to be ask before moving on anything. Cause of the laws and bla bla that's how it is.
My point is this... If you can invade a Foreign country without permission without being called on by that country to intervene or invade bla bla. Then why can't they just get in there without permission or being ask to help first.
He's the big man in charge and he is the so called most powerful man in the world, But he can't help out without permission? That's just silly really. Other states might ask other states for aid assistance and they will wait till then but i think the head of the country should wait for noone.

[Fleet 500]

And then he waiting 24 hours after the disaster?
Why offer just help. And don't get me wrong and think i don't understand what you have said about the mayors and gov's waiting to check the damage of what has happen, And then the President waiting to be ask before moving on anything. Cause of the laws and bla bla that's how it is.
My point is this... If you can invade a Foreign country without permission without being called on by that country to intervene or invade bla bla. Then why can't they just get in there without permission or being ask to help first.
He's the big man in charge and he is the so called most powerful man in the world, But he can't help out without permission? That's just silly really. Other states might ask other states for aid assistance and they will wait till then but i think the head of the country should wait for noone.

It didn't take any longer for hurrcaine relief to arrive after Katrina than it did for hurricanes Andrew and Floyd. Obiously, the only reason some people are complaining is because Bush happens to be President. Neither Bush's father nor Clinton sent in relief until it was asked for; G.W. Bush acted no different in this case.

President Bush did not invade a foreign country without permission. The Iraqi invasion (and removal of Saddam) passed through Congress (unlike Clinton, btw, who sent troops to several foreign countries without Congressional approval). In fact, the decision to kick out Saddam was made years before Bush became President. In 1998, Congress passed and Clinton signed, a bill calling for regime change in Iraq. How interesting that some people "forget" that!

[Matra et Alpine]

President Bush did not invade a foreign country without permission. The Iraqi invasion (and removal of Saddam) passed through Congress (unlike Clinton, btw, who sent troops to several foreign countries without Congressional approval). In fact, the decision to kick out Saddam was made years before Bush became President. In 1998, Congress passed and Clinton signed, a bill calling for regime change in Iraq. How interesting that some people "forget" that!

See you make a valid point about the hurricane relief and then drop into this nonsense again.

That CONGRESS votes gives the US the rights to do ANYTHING it wants within the confines of the USA. It does NOT then give it ANY RIGHTS to act outwith their own boundaries. I suggest you read a little on international law.

Clinton may not have sought Congress as he may have felt as President he didnt' need to - I don' know the details of the limits of the office - BUT note that Clinton on those occasion DID seek and get the approval of the International bodies involved SPOT THE DIFFERENCE ?

And re the "regime change" Clinton plans they were about using international procedures and organisations to achieve it and he clearly WAS seeking US approval to then undertake UN programs as would be agreed by ALL nations.


You still havent' grasped two things ..... there IS International Law and just because Clinton may have (or not) been a prat doesn't make any difference to the evaluation of GWB and HIS actions !!!!

( Or do you steal a car every morning to go to work because someone else stole one last night in the city ??? )

[Fleet 500]

See you make a valid point about the hurricane relief and then drop into this nonsense again.

That CONGRESS votes gives the US the rights to do ANYTHING it wants within the confines of the USA. It does NOT then give it ANY RIGHTS to act outwith their own boundaries. I suggest you read a little on international law.

Clinton may not have sought Congress as he may have felt as President he didnt' need to - I don' know the details of the limits of the office - BUT note that Clinton on those occasion DID seek and get the approval of the International bodies involved SPOT THE DIFFERENCE ?

And re the "regime change" Clinton plans they were about using international procedures and organisations to achieve it and he clearly WAS seeking US approval to then undertake UN programs as would be agreed by ALL nations.


You still havent' grasped two things ..... there IS International Law and just because Clinton may have (or not) been a prat doesn't make any difference to the evaluation of GWB and HIS actions !!!!

The nonsense began when SlickHolden claimed that Bush invaded a foreign country (a country which broke numerous treaties) "without permission."
Yeah, there is an international law (which Saddam ignored), however, the U.S. does not need permission to defend herself. And, the U.S. does not have to belong to the U.N.
The U.N had 12 years to deal with Saddam and Iraq and failed.

Well, at least you *seem* to agree with my hurricane relief comments.

[Matra et Alpine]

The nonsense began when SlickHolden claimed that Bush invaded a foreign country (a country which broke numerous treaties) "without permission."

So if your best mate gives you "permission" to steal the car it's OK then ?
PLEASE learn abotu law and jurisdiction

Yeah, there is an international law (which Saddam ignored), however, the U.S. does not need permission to defend herself.

Whoops, tripped yourself BACK into a statement you've made the mistake on before nad LOTS of evidence given to show your error and NONE from you to prove othrewise.
IRAQ as a sovereign nation did NOT attack the US.
Learn about law and jurisdiction.

And, the U.S. does not have to belong to the U.N.
The U.N had 12 years to deal with Saddam and Iraq and failed.

and had said that with 3 more months they would have proven the WMDs.
AGAIN you've tripped back into a fantasy PROVEN to you to be inconsistent with the facts
BTW the UN has had 40+ years to deal with Israel. When are the US going to invade ?? Two-faced hypocritical action is what is underpinning much of the discontent in the muslim nations

Well, at least you *seem* to agree with my hurricane relief comments.

Yes, I've never had a problem learning more and concurring with others.
IUt's the lack of facts and the twisting informatino that gets "on my goat"
See 90% of the rest of your post

[Fleet 500]

So if your best mate gives you "permission" to steal the car it's OK then ?
PLEASE learn abotu law and jurisdiction

Whoops, tripped yourself BACK into a statement you've made the mistake on before nad LOTS of evidence given to show your error and NONE from you to prove othrewise.
IRAQ as a sovereign nation did NOT attack the US.
Learn about law and jurisdiction.

and had said that with 3 more months they would have proven the WMDs.
AGAIN you've tripped back into a fantasy PROVEN to you to be inconsistent with the facts
BTW the UN has had 40+ years to deal with Israel. When are the US going to invade ?? Two-faced hypocritical action is what is underpinning much of the discontent in the muslim nations

Yes, I've never had a problem learning more and concurring with others.
IUt's the lack of facts and the twisting informatino that gets "on my goat"
See 90% of the rest of your post

"Stealing cars..." Who's twisting things now?

Iraq... a "sovereign" nation? LOL! How many "sovereign" nations do you know that murder their own people, pull parents out of their own houses during the night to rape and torture and kill and put living citizens into grinding machines? Was Japan a sovereign nation during WWII?

Regarding the WMD, it was up to Saddam to show evidence he destroyed WMD and WMD programs. Giving the U.N. "3 more months" (after giving them 12 years) would have made no difference.

Israel is not a threat to the U.S. No excuse for allowing Saddam to break 17 U.N. resolutions and a cease-fire agreement.

[Matra et Alpine]

"Stealing cars..." Who's twisting things now?

JESUS H CHRIST Fleet !!!

it was only 2 posts earlier ....

So if your best mate gives you "permission" to steal the car it's OK then ?

Do you have a reading disorder ?
Folks know I occasionally have a serious typing problem and cut some slack.
If you truly have a reading problem we would understand and do likewise.

Or is "analogy" to hard to cope with

Iraq... a "sovereign" nation? LOL! How many "sovereign" nations do you know that murder their own people, pull parents out of their own houses during the night to rape and torture and kill and put living citizens into grinding machines? Was Japan a sovereign nation during WWII?

FFS< go buy a dictionary, I'll send you the cash.
LEARN what a sovereign nation is before making up nonsense.
I seem to have said before ...... sometimes it's best to keep quiet and be thought a fool rather than typing and proving it
Japan attacked at Pearl Harbour AS a sovereign nation. War was declared under international LAW. You're making pointless, inappropriate and downright WRONG comparisons --- AGAIN !!!!
To get BACK to the point, Iraq was a sovereign nation and as such is protected under international law from aggression.

Regarding the WMD, it was up to Saddam to show evidence he destroyed WMD and WMD programs. Giving the U.N. "3 more months" (after giving them 12 years) would have made no difference.

What a load of BS, Fleet.
You have been given the evidence MANY times about the WMDs.
Sorry but I call you out DIRECTLY as a LIAR
You have been presented with facts from ALL involved and NOT ONCE been able to present evidence to the contrary that wasnt' tainted and unbelievable.
So you MUST KNOW you are now lying in repeating that statement.
OR cutting you some slack ... IF you have a mental disorder that occasionally makes you unable to comprehend right from wrong it's OK to let us know and we can do the same as the reading skills issue

Israel is not a threat to the U.S. No excuse for allowing Saddam to break 17 U.N. resolutions and a cease-fire agreement.

Shame you can't apply logic in your thinking.
You've had all the evidence PROVING to you that Iraq posed no direct threat to the US. Colin Powell has come out and agreed OOPS.
And to get you to at least ONCE in this thread to THINK.... so why does the US block in the Security Council UN actions against Israel ? Is it OK for a nation to be a threat to someone else and for the US to prevent any action being taken ?
THAT is the style of a playground bully

[Coventrysucks]

Anyone who makes a move ("documentary," whatever it's called) with 59 inaccuracies in it an idiot.

So if George W. Bush has made 59 inaccuracies in various adresses that makes him an idiot?

All this name calling doesn't do anything positive.

They should get on with helping people, and then find out exactly who was responsible for what and then correct the problems so it doesn't happen again.

Of course it doesn't help when you have idiots that, after seeing all of the devastation caused in Lousiana, are refusing to evacuate for the current hurricane because they evacuated last time.

Also - try not building houses in a flood-risk/ hurricane-risk/ tornado-risk area out of wood.

Do they not have the story of the Three Little Pigs in the USA or something?

Maybe Mr Moore should be down in New Orleans distributing aid, and maybe Mr Bush should get his act together so that it isn't hideously easy to make fun of him.