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Thread: "Uneconomic" diesel for Ford Territory

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by fpv_gtho
    Alot of the small Euro's with diesel engines, if it had a petrol engine you'd have to stick premium unleaded in them anyway, as they dont work off 91 octane.
    All VAG FSI engines need 98RON. I was surprised when I saw that a base 2litre 110kw FSI 4 cylinder like in the Jetta needed it.
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by fpv_gtho
    Theres 2 variants of the 2.7L V6 to consider, theres a newly released one being built at the same plant as the V6, but thats reserved atm. There'd be a variety of truck diesels, but i cant think of many else that would compare with the 2.7 that Ford would have access to.
    Reportedly Ford is working on a V8 variant of this engine, which I am sure will silence all critical sounds about diesel being lound, lazy and smelley (filters will take care of that).
    Apart from that the choice for whatever fuel will be to a large extent depending on the government levies put on those fuels. You can bet that in case low taxed LPG will become the predominant way of propulsion, the government will start looking for compensation for the reduction in income.

    On top of that it has to be realised that LPG propelled cars, and I am now talking about Europe, have restricted access to some premises, liking parking garages and are totally banned from travelling the Europe-UK Tunnel, in spite of the fact that all cars are put on trains and the engines are off.

    Finally, the use of LPG will always require two fuel tanks, resulting in less space and additional weight.
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

  3. #18
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    That COULD be the engine i refered to, its being built alongside the 2.7 right? If so, theyre only building 25K units for the first couple of years...

    Conventionally, LPG does have 2 tanks, when its setup for dual fuel, but Ford in particular run Falcons on 100% LPG here, so whilst its still the one tank, they dont have the LPG tanks in the same place as the petrol tanks, in the rear section of the floor, so they still do reduce the boot space.

    On top of that it has to be realised that LPG propelled cars, and I am now talking about Europe, have restricted access to some premises, liking parking garages and are totally banned from travelling the Europe-UK Tunnel, in spite of the fact that all cars are put on trains and the engines are off.
    That really is weird. Forklifts here at least, HAVE to be on LPG if theyre going to be used indoors for the reduced emissions..
    Last edited by fpv_gtho; 05-16-2006 at 12:37 AM.
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by fpv_gtho
    That COULD be the engine i refered to, its being built alongside the 2.7 right? If so, theyre only building 25K units for the first couple of years...

    Conventionally, LPG does have 2 tanks, when its setup for dual fuel, but Ford in particular run Falcons on 100% LPG here, so whilst its still the one tank, they dont have the LPG tanks in the same place as the petrol tanks, in the rear section of the floor, so they still do reduce the boot space.



    That really is weird. Forklifts here at least, HAVE to be on LPG if theyre going to be used indoors for the reduced emissions..
    the 2.7 PSA/Ford engine is the standard fit for the European cars, like the
    C6, the 607 and the Jaguars. The V8 is being developed out of that and will surely also see the light in the Jaguars and the US Fords
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

  5. #20
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    I was wondering when you'd show up
    Quote Originally Posted by henk4
    Apart from that the choice for whatever fuel will be to a large extent depending on the government levies put on those fuels. You can bet that in case low taxed LPG will become the predominant way of propulsion, the government will start looking for compensation for the reduction in income.
    As I understand it, European diesel is taxed much lower than petrol, hence its predominance over there. With that in mind, are you similarly expecting euro governments to increase their levies on distillate, to compensate for the reduction in income?
    On top of that it has to be realised that LPG propelled cars, and I am now talking about Europe, have restricted access to some premises, liking parking garages and are totally banned from travelling the Europe-UK Tunnel, in spite of the fact that all cars are put on trains and the engines are off.
    No such restrictions here Btw I hear that Falcon LPG utes, as sold new in Britain, were/are exempt from central London's access restrictions due to their low-emission vehicle status
    Finally, the use of LPG will always require two fuel tanks, resulting in less space and additional weight.
    Why two tanks?

    It could likewise be argued that diesels also mandate additional space and weight, resulting from heavier engine blocks/battery/starter/turbochargers/intercooler/particulate filters etc - not forgetting these new tanks of piss .. sorry urine .. sorry UREA! .. to cleanse their cancerous carcinogen clouds

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by nota
    As I understand it, European diesel is taxed much lower than petrol, hence its predominance over there. With that in mind, are you similarly expecting euro governments to increase their levies on distillate, to compensate for the reduction in income?

    Why two tanks?

    It could likewise be argued that diesels also mandate additional space and weight, resulting from heavier engine blocks/battery/starter/turbochargers/intercooler/particulate filters etc - not forgetting these new tanks of piss .. sorry urine .. sorry UREA! .. to cleanse their cancerous carcinogen clouds
    In many European countries diesel is about the same price as petrol, but yes, in general diesel fuel is less taxed. (However I pay a considerable amount, about 500 Euro p/a, of additional road tax for having the pleasure of driving a diesel). There is now also a additional sales tax on new diesel vehicles, but not for those fitted with a particulate filter. (comparable in size and weight to cat. converters for gasoline cars).

    LPG cars in Holland have two tanks, as they may also be required to use petrol in areas where LPG supply is not guaranteed. Additional space is also required as by law the LPG tank can only be filled up to 85% of its nominal capacity. LPG filling stations are not allowed in urban areas.
    The use of LPG mostly gives a maximum range of about 400 km if you are lucky, while my diesel gives me at least twice the range, reducing the need for fuel stops.
    The additional weight of the diesel engine and its aggregate I take for granted, given the excellent performance and economy you are getting from a modern diesel. (As the Ford guy mentioned, modern diesels are totally different from those built 5, (from a European prespective 10) years ago.

    I will receive a new car with a particulate filter sometime during next week, I will start saving on the toilet use
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by henk4
    I will receive a new car with a particulate filter sometime during next week, I will start saving on the toilet use
    Don't forget to take pictures !

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lagonda
    Don't forget to take pictures !
    of the toilet use????
    "I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams

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