Old days vs new

**QBridge** · 06-26-2006, 12:46 AM

I remeber the good old days for cars back in the early through late 90s. There was the turbo Toyota MR2, the turbo 300zx, the turbo Toyota Supra, the Nissan 240sx the turbo Mazda RX7 and the AWD Mitsu 3000GT and back then gas was cheap. I wish I was the age I am now in the 90s when all these good cars where around and gas was cheap.

Now there is no cars like those cars that were built back then and the car market is dull. These days there is only the Honda S2k which is a slow car even tuned, the Nissan 350z and the VQ35DE sucks, there is the Subaru STi which is AWD and slow, the Mitsu Evo which is slow and that is about it for imports that are worth tuning.

It seems to me like everything these days is plain and boring and before in the good old days it was good but there was no aftermarket but now there is but there is no cars. The timing was all off. Do you all think the same way I do? Will a future car market look better than the one in the 90s? What is there to look forward to considering gas prices keep rising?

**clutch-monkey** · 06-26-2006, 12:53 AM

Originally Posted by QBridge

Now there is no cars like those cars that were built back then and the car market is dull. These days there is only the Honda S2k which is a slow car even tuned, the Nissan 350z and the VQ35DE sucks, there is the Subaru STi which is AWD and slow, the Mitsu Evo which is slow and that is about it for imports that are worth tuning.

i think you're an idiot. but i agree with what you are trying to say.

**KnifeEdge_2K1** · 06-26-2006, 01:08 AM

the s2k and evo aint slow, i agree on the 350 and the sti

**TheOne** · 06-26-2006, 01:12 AM

Originally Posted by QBridge

Now there is no cars like those cars that were built back then and the car market is dull. These days there is only the Honda S2k which is a slow car even tuned, the Nissan 350z and the VQ35DE sucks, there is the Subaru STi which is AWD and slow, the Mitsu Evo which is slow and that is about it for imports that are worth tuning.

wondering.......wtf are you smoking? the vq doesn't suck, the STi has 300hp stock and AWD, the evo's have had good tuning(AMS....900+AWHP street car + their race car). and imports aren't the only 1's good for tuning(the 03-04 cobra comes in mind, so does the new GT's), there's more on the list.

the only thing i may agree with is the fact that gas prices have somewhat affected engines, and that the 90's was a good era for performnace cars, and well, in the future, depending on how things go, the retro era still going(challenger, camaro if either are built), then there's also new imports like the R-35 GTR(if built) and there's a couple of other concepts which there's a posibility of bein built. Also there is technology out there that will allow for more horsepower, who knows if with gasoline, water or other type of fuel will be powering that.

**Spastik_Roach** · 06-26-2006, 01:24 AM

Originally Posted by clutch-monkey

i think you're an idiot. but i agree with what you are trying to say.

Geez, everyone seems to be saying exactly what i'm thinking for me today! good show

**2ndclasscitizen** · 06-26-2006, 01:38 AM

The modern cars you listed are faster than the older ones you mentioned. The VQ35DE is an evolution of the VG30DE, APS offers a TT kit for the 350Z that gives 400rwhp on stock internals and bugger all boost. S2000s are tuned to pull ~10,000rpm. The EJ20T and EJ25T can make some huge numbers, same goes the 4G63. All these engines are just as good, probably better than any of the engines you listed. Just because they can't make 1000hp f00l on standard internals with naWz doesn't mean they're shit engines.

**Ferrer** · 06-26-2006, 03:12 AM

there are some great cars from the 80's and 90's to be missed though, like the Escort RS Cosworth or the 205 GTI.

**6'bore** · 06-26-2006, 03:55 AM

Originally Posted by QBridge

Now there is no cars like those cars that were built back then and the car market is dull. These days there is only the Honda S2k which is a slow car even tuned, the Nissan 350z and the VQ35DE sucks, there is the Subaru STi which is AWD and slow, the Mitsu Evo which is slow and that is about it for imports that are worth tuning.

You are insane!

I strongly suggest you take a dictionary and look up the word slow.

A Stock STi is probably faster than any of the cars from the 80's you mentioned.

**Ferrer** · 06-26-2006, 04:53 AM

Originally Posted by 6'bore

You are insane!

I strongly suggest you take a dictionary and look up the word slow.

A Stock STi is probably faster than any of the cars from the 80's you mentioned.

On the twisties sure. On the straights you could be surprised. Top Gear ran some generation races many shows ago, and the oldies actually won...

**cmcpokey** · 06-26-2006, 01:45 PM

you know... i couldn't disagree with you more. the cars form the 90s were so weak for styling. all of the cars became round and smoothe and looked exactly like eachother. espcially american cars. we are coming out of that phase and into the phase where design is once again in the forefront. car designers are taking risks with cars. look at subaru for example. their cars today are off the charts of being wacky designs, and those would have never flown 10 years ago. supercars were basically non-existant, with the exception of the F-50, the NSX, the ancient diablo, and a scant collection of others. Porsche went to water coolled cars, made em look funny, and slowed them way the hell down. everything was built cheaply, in a focus group manner, and nobody gave a shit about them being fun to drive, or have high hp from the factory. you could not buy a rwd car that didnt weigh 2 tons. today the big 3 are going back to rwd, and we are in the middle of a hp war that hasn't been seen since the 60s. you can buy 400+hp cars from the factory from a larger number of manufacturers than there were 400hp+ car models in the 90s. so would i rather have cars from then, hell no. i love the point we are at, and wouldnt change a thing.

**rev440** · 06-26-2006, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by TheOne

wondering.......wtf are you smoking? the vq doesn't suck, the STi has 300hp stock and AWD, the evo's have had good tuning(AMS....900+AWHP street car + their race car). and imports aren't the only 1's good for tuning(the 03-04 cobra comes in mind, so does the new GT's), there's more on the list.

To bad AMS wont send the car to race a little mustang cobra on the street. Theres so many fast cobras with whipples, KB's, ported eatons, and the big boy the helion turbo kit. The STI is not slow by any means and it is an impressive little package exspically when you see 2 of them go at it on a 1/4. Im pretty sure the redline on the S2k is 9krpm not the 10k stated above. One thing tuned is a ricers term modded is what most of us say. The early to mid 90's werent that bad with the Viper being introduced in 92 packing 400hp and then the LT1 camaro and corvette were no slouches either. Then in 1997 the C5 LS1 powered Corvette was produced but that is really out of the era we are talking about.

**Ferrer** · 06-26-2006, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by cmcpokey

you know... i couldn't disagree with you more. the cars form the 90s were so weak for styling. all of the cars became round and smoothe and looked exactly like eachother. espcially american cars. we are coming out of that phase and into the phase where design is once again in the forefront. car designers are taking risks with cars. look at subaru for example. their cars today are off the charts of being wacky designs, and those would have never flown 10 years ago. supercars were basically non-existant, with the exception of the F-50, the NSX, the ancient diablo, and a scant collection of others. Porsche went to water coolled cars, made em look funny, and slowed them way the hell down. everything was built cheaply, in a focus group manner, and nobody gave a shit about them being fun to drive, or have high hp from the factory. you could not buy a rwd car that didnt weigh 2 tons. today the big 3 are going back to rwd, and we are in the middle of a hp war that hasn't been seen since the 60s. you can buy 400+hp cars from the factory from a larger number of manufacturers than there were 400hp+ car models in the 90s. so would i rather have cars from then, hell no. i love the point we are at, and wouldnt change a thing.

You couldn't be more wrong my friend. Yes american cars were shit, as they have been since the mid 70's (now they are slowly trying to get back). But everywhere else the automotive industry was on a roll. Americans should learn to look outside their tiny little country...

The late 80's and early 90's was a golden era for hot hatches. Cars were quite powerful, and above all light. There was the Golf GTI Mk I and Mk II, the little Renault 5 GT Turbo and later the Clio Williams, the Peugeot 205 GTI and the 106 GTI, the Opel Kadett GSI and Astra GSI, the Lancia Delta HF 4WD and HF Integrale, and so the list nearly endless. Everything got it's hot version, and some where seriously fast and seriously good to drive.

Then on this era we got also some of the last rear driven action before everyone switched to front driven cars for everything and also some proper drivers cars. Cars like the Alfa Romeo GTV6 and the SZ or the original BMW M3 or the Ford Capri 2.8i. We got also cars like the BMW M5 or the Audi RS2. Meanwhile Porsche produced arguably the best proper 911 ever, the 993, Honda showed us that supercars didn't necesarily have to broke down every 500 metres. And Mazda re-introduced the roadster into the market with the MX-5, which is known to be a seriously good drivers car.

And now supercars. In this period of time was when finally supercars came into it's own. To name just a few, Ferrari 288 GTO, Ferrari F40, Porsche 959, Jaguar XJR-15, Jaguar XJ220, McLaren F1, Bugatti EB110, Lamborghini Countach, Lamborghini Diablo, the Lotus Esprit V8...

The 80's and 90's also provided us with some of the most spectacular racing machinery ever seen. They gave us Group B rally supercars, turbocharged F1 cars which had in excess of 1000bhp and Group C endurance race cars that could top 400km/h on the Mulsanne straight at Le Mans.

So you see the 80's and 90's weren't bad at all, far from it...

**The_Canuck** · 06-26-2006, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by rev440

One thing tuned is a ricers term modded is what most of us say.

ok...lol

Any way, on topic, why do you think the STi is slow? it keeps up with base 911's for what at least 10 grand less. And the s2000 isn't meant to be a drag car its a nice capable roadster.

**cmcpokey** · 06-26-2006, 03:12 PM