2009 Corvette ZR1 LS9 Engine

[bruxell]

By the standards of cars I'm able to afford, a C6 is pretty "fancy." Sorry, was I being a "wisenhimer?" I'll put the "kibosh" on the "Tom-foolery..."

[henk4]

By the standards of cars I'm able to afford, a C6 is pretty "fancy." Sorry, was I being a "wisenhimer?" I'll put the "kibosh" on the "Tom-foolery..."

I am afraid I did not see enough Seinfeld to be able to follow that....

[bruxell]

I am afraid I did not see enough Seinfeld to be able to follow that....

No Seinfeld involved, just a lot of obsolete lexicon...

[henk4]

No Seinfeld involved, just a lot of obsolete lexicon...

the essence of Seinfeld...

[bruxell]

the essence of Seinfeld...

Point taken...

[Matra et Alpine]

Lets not do this again henk, those figures are not realistic in America we have different roads and drive differently.
Just face the facts, on our roads Corvette owners are averaging around 20-25mpg.

Waken up SLicks

THe EPA has acccepted that the measurement is not representative and HAVE PROPOSED the changes to update it similar to what ECE did years ago.

So YOUR EXPERTS disagree with you !!!

[Kitdy]

strange, we most of the time struggle to get less than our ece ratings, but as Slicks in all his wisdom and surely based on his overwhelming experience just pointed out, we drive differently from Americans. (and while your fatality rate in traffic accidents is about 1 per 7000 inhabitants, ours is close to 1 per 20000)

That may be due to driving styles or due to environmental differences, road differences, etc. It is not necessarily just because of different driving styles. It may even be a bit of each.

But they do.

Have a look at the dominant Corvette C5R and C6R. They had to go down a division because their dominance caused all others to leave GT1.

After reviewing the available information to me, I don't think that there is enough information to verify that one setup is better than the other. I will attempt to investigate further.

You need to start looking outside the box man. So even though the LSx's are lighter, smaller and make just as much power/torque they are some how more "lame"?
I guess all the people swaping LSx's in to Miatas, BMWs, RX7, 240SXs, skylines, EVOs, WRXs, Mustangs, S2000s, (almost all loosing weight, and gaining much power) and various kit cars are also lame then?
Why would cars not really limited by price, like the Mosler, and Ultima GTR use the LS1? Why would the Saleen S7 use a pushrod engine?
Do we have to do another BMW 5L V10 vs LS7 thread?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have an LSx engine in my car - a dream car for me is a 944 with an LS1 swap - they are cheap, easy to maintain and simple - but this does not mean that they are the best.

If you'll remember I was on your side in the S85B50? (I think) vs LS7 thread.

Here is some further information about pushrods against other engine configurations.

From Wikipedia:

Engine: F140
Car: 2002 Ferrari Enzo
Type: DOHC V12
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.33

Engine: 13B-MSP
Car: 2003 Mazda RX-8
Type: 2-Rotor Wankel
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.32

(I found another site with a much lower P/W ratio - maybe this is a mistake or the other site was a mistake)

Engine: M80
Car: 2005 Porsche Carrera GT
Type: DOHC V10
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.28

Engine: LS7
Car: 2006 Corvette Z06
Type: Pushrod V8
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.1

Engine: AMG 6.3
Car: 2007 Mercedes CLK63 AMG
Type: DOHC V8
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.08

Engine: LS3
Car: 2008 Chevrolet Corvette C6
Type: Pushrod V8
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.02

Engine: S85
Car: 2007 BMW M5 & BMW M6
Type: DOHC V10
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 0.94

This however, conclusively proves nothing. There is more to an engine than peak hp and power to weight ratio - such as the torque curve. It's just an interesting conversation starter.

I also think (based on rudimentary engine knowledge) that the torque curves for a similarilly sized displacement engines for performance pushrod and DOHC engines would be about the same.

If this is true, then it is likely that a performance DOHC engine with the same displacement as the Z06 would have a similar torque curve, weigh more, but have more torque, more hp, more torque / weight, and more power / weight (I realize that this is a bit of a guess) This engine may cost more than the LS7 however, as it needs to rev higher possibly?

[monaroCountry]

From: Fuel Economy

Now consider that one is using turbo to boost power whilst the other is doing it in N/A form. Also consider that the Porsche has a lower power output as compared with the Vette.

2008 Porsche 911 Turbo
New EPA MPG

Premium Gasoline
18 - Combined
16 - City
23 - Hwy

Fuel Economics
Cost to Drive 25 Miles - $4.61
Fuel to Drive 25 Miles - 1.39 gal


2008 Chevrolet Corvette

New EPA MPG

Premium Gasoline
18 - Combined
15 - City
24 - Hwy

Fuel Economics
Cost to Drive 25 Miles - $4.61
Fuel to Drive 25 Miles - 1.39 gal

[kingofthering]

From Wikipedia:

Engine: 13B-MSP
Car: 2003 Mazda RX-8
Type: 2-Rotor Wankel
Power to weight ratio (in hp/lb.): 1.32

(I found another site with a much lower P/W ratio - maybe this is a mistake or the other site was a mistake)

It's probably not a mistake, since the model with the automatic gearbox produces a lot less horsepower.

[henk4]

From: Fuel Economy

Now consider that one is using turbo to boost power whilst the other is doing it in N/A form. Also consider that the Porsche has a lower power output as compared with the Vette.

please consider then also that the Z06 has a peak torque of 645 nm at 4800 revs, and the Turbo only 620 nm, but at 1950 revs.....

[Kitdy]

please consider then also that the Z06 has a peak torque of 645 nm at 4800 revs, and the Turbo only 620 nm, but at 1950 revs.....

Another thing to consider is that the Z06 costs much less than the 911 Turbo.

[henk4]

Another thing to consider is that the Z06 costs much less than the 911 Turbo.

quality has its price...

[Rockefella]

quality has its price...

But $50,000+ is too much to argue towards 'quality'.

[henk4]

But $50,000+ is too much to argue towards 'quality'.

obviously not for those who can afford it...

[Kitdy]

quality has its price...

Frugality has it's benefits as well.

Someone that bought a Corvette and had enough money to buy a Turbo would have all that extra money to use for gas. Besides, they have similar straight line speed and similar track performance.