Bugatti Veyron EB 16.4 Grand Sport 2009-

[LeonOfTheDead]

They both make supercars.

the Zonda will be built in a few more than 100 units units within 4 different engines up to now (considering the original one with the MB 6 liters, the enlarged version to 7 liters, the new 7.3 of the S and F and the upcoming Cinque and the 7 liters from the CLK-GTR) at least 1 million dollars per car, even if the actual price is closer to 1 million euro. the car is hand built, for real and I can guarantee since I visited both the factories, based on your requests, and it comes even equipped with a pair of shoes and a set of two luggages of the same leather of your car. the factory consists of three rooms and is smaller than my parents' house, you can meet the owner and founder while visiting it and he would sign the model of the car you will buy if you ask him. I did so, but he left the building for lunch just a couple of minutes before.
the Murcielago costs about a quarter and will be built built probably in more than 5000 units with just a mayor restyling. The factory is pretty small for such a big manufacturer, but it's still a big factory, and even if the assembly line of the Murcielago is quite manual if confronted with that of the Gallardo, the assembly of the single parts isn't so. together with the Gallardo models, Lamborghini has a huge parking lot behind the factory with more than 300 cars parked there in every moment before of the delivering. check google earth.
not discussing the "supercars" definition, which actually doesn't exist, but you have to admit they are two different kind of "supercars".
Maybe the Reventòn is a true supercar, but I can't stand the fact that it is a re-bodied Murcielago at four times the original price.

[Ferrer]

Yes, Lambo isn't at Pagani's level for now. But they could be.

The Murcielago is more a rival to the 599 GTB, it's an old school supercar that's been outclassed by the newer generation but that's fine. The new Lambo can be a rival to the Paganis and Enzos.

I just can't quite see the need for another brand. Unless you want to turn PVAG into GM or BL, just more expensive.

[NSXType-R]

Wow, I didn't think that the Pagani Zonda was built in such small numbers and was so expensive. I thought that it was comparable to the Murcielago in price and numbers.

I was wondering why I can't see any of them when I go to NYC.

BTW, no one's answered my earlier question. What was the Porsche "supercars" (it doesn't matter if it's just a go-fast version(s) of the 911, I just want the fastest) before the 959?

[Kooper]

I guess at a stretch you could've called the 550 Spyder a for-its-time supercar, but that's just me guessing.

To me the whole VW group seems to make so many overlapping cars these days (Polo vs. Toledo, A3 vs. Golf vs. Leon, Passat vs. A4, Phaeton vs. A8, R8 vs. Gallardo and now vs. 911, TT vs. Boxster, Q7 vs. Touareg vs. Cayenne, there's probably more), what difference will overlapping supercars make to the already confusing line-up?

I really hope VW puts Bugatti up for sale and someone like BMW comes along and snaps up the nameplate. They have RR for luxo-barges, but no suitable nameplate for a true supercar yet (as much as I liked the M1 I just cannot see BMW translating their current styling to a mid-engined supercar).
Wouldn't it be nice to have a Bugatti supercar in the same price range as a Lambo? It doesn't have to be capable of 400 plus kays an hour, doesn't have to weigh as much as a ship and doesn't need to cost as much as one either.
I am just dreaming out loud here btw.

[Kitdy]

BTW, no one's answered my earlier question. What was the Porsche "supercars" (it doesn't matter if it's just a go-fast version(s) of the 911, I just want the fastest) before the 959?

There weren't really Porsche supercars before the 959 but I guess the 911 Carrera 2.7 RS would be the best example. That was around in 1973.

[NSXType-R]

I guess at a stretch you could've called the 550 Spyder a for-its-time supercar, but that's just me guessing.

To me the whole VW group seems to make so many overlapping cars these days (Polo vs. Toledo, A3 vs. Golf vs. Leon, Passat vs. A4, Phaeton vs. A8, R8 vs. Gallardo and now vs. 911, TT vs. Boxster, Q7 vs. Touareg vs. Cayenne, there's probably more), what difference will overlapping supercars make to the already confusing line-up?

I really hope VW puts Bugatti up for sale and someone like BMW comes along and snaps up the nameplate. They have RR for luxo-barges, but no suitable nameplate for a true supercar yet (as much as I liked the M1 I just cannot see BMW translating their current styling to a mid-engined supercar).
Wouldn't it be nice to have a Bugatti supercar in the same price range as a Lambo? It doesn't have to be capable of 400 plus kays an hour, doesn't have to weigh as much as a ship and doesn't need to cost as much as one either.
I am just dreaming out loud here btw.

Gotcha.

But BMW has RR already and can make superfast super luxurious coupes as it is. They don't need Buggati.

There weren't really Porsche supercars before the 959 but I guess the 911 Carrera 2.7 RS would be the best example. That was around in 1973.

I see.

[Ferrer]

There weren't really Porsche supercars before the 959 but I guess the 911 Carrera 2.7 RS would be the best example. That was around in 1973.

Well it was more of a sportscar. In 1973 you could buy a Lamborghini Miura P400 SV which was a proper supercar. Maybe the 930 Turbo but despite startling perfomance it was still a 911.

[clutch-monkey]

There weren't really Porsche supercars before the 959 but I guess the 911 Carrera 2.7 RS would be the best example. That was around in 1973.

weren't there roadgoing versions of the 906/904?

[henk4]

weren't there roadgoing versions of the 906/904?

they were road legal GTs but not ones that you would consider as a daily driver. (and only 2 litres)

[clutch-monkey]

they were road legal GTs but not ones that you would consider as a daily driver. (and only 2 litres)

are there many supercars of that period that you could honestly consider a daily driver though? (thinking of the countach especially)

[Ferrer]

are there many supercars of that period that you could honestly consider a daily driver though? (thinking of the countach especially)

But the Countach was a road car not a racer.

Altough maybe this could be considered Porsche's first supercar...

[henk4]

are there many supercars of that period that you could honestly consider a daily driver though? (thinking of the countach especially)

the 904 preceeds the Countach by ten years...
A Miura was usable, as was a Daytona.
Before that a Ferrari 250GT or a Jaguar EType or a DB4-5 could be seen as "supercars" Of course there were exclusive models like a Maserati 5000GT or a Ferrari Superfast, but those were mostly unique hand made cars with individual design aspects.

[henk4]

But the Countach was a road car not a racer.

Altough maybe this could be considered Porsche's first supercar...

you can picture anything from the Targa Florio, but it does not make them road cars....

[clutch-monkey]

the 904 preceeds the Countach by ten years...
A Miura was usable, as was a Daytona.

yes, but i didn't know it was that bad, well...not as bad as the porsche in ferrer's pic at least.
i agree it is certainly less user friendly than the cars you listed.

[henk4]

yes, but i didn't know it was that bad, well...not as bad as the porsche in ferrer's pic at least.
i agree it is certainly less user friendly than the cars you listed.

I never implied that 904 was a bad car at all
When it hit the road it was one of the fastest things you could buy.