Hyundai versus Kia

[pimento]

because the backseats are too small for people with legs and there is no room in the boot for anything more than a handbag... why buy are care that small with back seats, you would be better off getting a lotus elise. At least you would look good and still get good gas mileage...

You can fit a 4ft high potted plant in a Jazz (yes, same car as a Fit) standing up in the back. They'll also do high speed cruising if you want to (not my first choice for a road trip, obv.) and they are fine for around the town driving. My friend('s parents) had one, it suited the purpose just fine. We also fit five people in there adequately, rear leg room was fine for around the town stuff.

I appreciate they're not your cup of tea, they're not something I lust after either, but they have a place in the market and for some they're are the perfect vehicle. Personally I'd rather your old BMW too, I had an '85 E30 323i that was wonderful.. though legroom in the back was a little lacking.

[FastDriver]

I just don't see the appeal to cheap small cars with limited features and uncomfortable seating. Although I understand what you are saying. some people really just want a small cheap car that doesn't cost much to repair or maintain and still have being fairly newer. I have always prefered superior built quality if i have to buy an older model that is fine

[RacingManiac]

Ours have IRS, though, and most Toyota products the world over are just about irrelevant to gearheads, though they are by no means objectively "bad" cars.

I have heard that the Renaultsport Meganes are able to use their torsion beams quite well, but it does strike me as odd that the Yuroes aren't using IRS, with Honda even taking it away from one generation of (Euro)Civic to the next. Next thing you know we Americans, will be driving around in featherweight twin-turbo four-pot FWD Mustangs and all of Europe will be propelled by old tractor-engined buckboards.

Beam or no beam its all on how you tune it. They take up less space and allow for a flatter cargo floor. If you've seen how some the Peugeot IRS rear(407, one we have at work, in US) are laid out you can see why beams are so appealing. The way the 407 rear was set the shock had horrid motion ratio and the kinematic is rather "intriguing". At that point you might as well go with a beam set up and cost less money....

On really sporty models(like Renaultsport) IMO they can get away with more things since you are compromising more ride quality for out and out performance....on FWD car you don't want the rear to do that much work anyway...

Civic Type R JDM vs EU spec is kinda interesting since its rare you have the chance to compare the same car with different setup. The JDM model was superior but by all account that was much more hardcore car....

[Ferrer]

You can fit a 4ft high potted plant in a Jazz (yes, same car as a Fit) standing up in the back. They'll also do high speed cruising if you want to (not my first choice for a road trip, obv.) and they are fine for around the town driving. My friend('s parents) had one, it suited the purpose just fine. We also fit five people in there adequately, rear leg room was fine for around the town stuff.

I appreciate they're not your cup of tea, they're not something I lust after either, but they have a place in the market and for some they're are the perfect vehicle. Personally I'd rather your old BMW too, I had an '85 E30 323i that was wonderful.. though legroom in the back was a little lacking.

I'd happily have a Ford Puma or a Mini, you know...

[clutch-monkey]

what is a honda jazz? is that like the Honda fit? im not really interested in those super compact cars, like smaller than a ford focus, or honda civic, they are just so small its really rediculous and they become impractical for daily use.

the honda jazz/fit is the same size as the corolla and civic of ten years ago..

[pimento]

I'd happily have a Ford Puma or a Mini, you know...

Also good. Well, the Mini. Never considered a Pooma.

[Ferrer]

Also good. Well, the Mini. Never considered a Pooma.

Well it's pretty much like the Mini. Only the interior disintegrates after 10 minutes of ownership.

Which automatically makes it the Ford Puma Superleggera.

Probably.

[henk4]

Well it's pretty much like the Mini. Only the interior disintegrates after 10 minutes of ownership.

Which automatically makes it the Ford Puma Superleggera.

Probably.

Ask Drakkie

[pimento]

Ya, they weren't available here anyway.

[clutch-monkey]

i swear i've seen puma's around? or is that the cougar

[pimento]

Cougars we had, but we had the [kia] festiva, the Laser and the Laser Lynx instead of the Fiesta and Pooma.

I think we've covered this before somewhere..

[Matra et Alpine]

I just know that the Elan was probably my least favorite Lotus, and I love Lotus! That would explain why it was FWD though.

Talk about co-incidence
Check out what was competing at this weekends hillclimb ......

[FastDriver]

the honda jazz/fit is the same size as the corolla and civic of ten years ago..

yeah i remember growing up in the 80s how small they were :P my mom had a dodge omni when I was 4 years old, hit a dear and smashed the front end in real good :P

[drakkie]

Well it's pretty much like the Mini. Only the interior disintegrates after 10 minutes of ownership.

Which automatically makes it the Ford Puma Superleggera.

Probably.

And I won't even start on the weight reduction *cough* rust making various bits of the car disappear..

Good reason to save up money for my dream car. Hopefully it will be a Elise Mk.1... Some day..

[thebrochureman]

About reliabilaty, well both Hyundai and kia have great warrantys so they must be reliable because to give warrantys like that they have to test them and be confident that their reliable.