UCP: I need your help

[Cotterik]

give them/us sports cars so we can stop pretending our cars are sportscars and do things our cars cant handle and spin off the road into innocent old ladies / lamp posts.

[whiteballz]

Sports cars pros -
Increased driver training - perhaps include theoretical manditory courses for cars above a set power/weight ratio.

damage
- Include the point that if something is exclusive/a point of pride (like a nice phone or car) alot of people will treat it with alot of respect.

- While the risk of a youthful driver to floor it wherever he goes is higher - the safety surrounding that car is much higher than in a much smaller/older car. better tyres, brakes, electric assists, like ESC and TCS with ABS.

- If possible include that a while ago over here Toyota debuted a car that depending on what key you used to turn it on - Would supply different amounts of power/torque. So parents give their kids the key with the least power - great looks, but less power than fully allowed.

[CHEESE-TACULAR]

- If possible include that a while ago over here Toyota debuted a car that depending on what key you used to turn it on - Would supply different amounts of power/torque. So parents give their kids the key with the least power - great looks, but less power than fully allowed.

that is the coolest thing, link me to anything about it?

[whiteballz]

Toyota Sportivo Coupe Concept : News & Reports : Motoring : Web Wombat


[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Sportivo_Coupe]Toyota Sportivo Coupe - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]



2004 Toyota Sportivo Images, Information and History | Conceptcarz.com

[pimento]

My uncle had the idea that all new drivers should be on a motorbike for a year. 'Snot a bad idea.. most of them will learn to pay attention to everying going on around them and more of the idiots will be removed from the gene pool.

[wwgkd]

A sports car (and sports car's don't have to be power monsters, look at a Miata) could be considered safer in a couple ways I could think of. Some have already been stated, such as accident avoidance. But kind of an extension of that is that a car that can drive at 150 is going to be much better able to handle the driver doing something slightly stupid at 60 than a car that can only safely go 60.

Plus a car like that leads to greater driver awareness for what's going on. If you don't have the power to spin the tires then you're much more likely to floor it every where you go (see a lot of civic drivers doing that and not many viper drivers.) The first time you don't have traction (say first rain in a while and the roads are really slick) then that bad habit and lack of awareness of how a car will respond at the limits can bite you in the @ss.

Of course there's easier passing, and much shorter emergency braking. An example of the braking was that once I was going through sacramento in my dad's truck (****ing hate the drivers there) on my way to pick up a trailer when traffic slowed down pretty quickly and I had to brake hard. Some idiot in a little geo decided that was the perfect time to cut into my lane and I had to stomp on the brakes hard to keep from rolling right over him (have no idea how I didn't hit him.) The 911 behind me that had been tailgaiting ended up stopping 15 feet further back than me despite having no warning and less space to stop than me; where I could have been in an accident, he was never in any danger at all. Brakes being one of the most important safety devices on a car, it makes sense the lighter weight and better brakes of a sports car would be much safer. Emergency lane change is a common saftey test, and one that's usually dominated by sports cars.

When all is said and done I'd much rather avoid an accident through greater awareness and abilities (both mine and the vehicles) than try to live through it. Remember that someone who's going to drive like an idiot will probably drive likethat in anything, so I'm not so sure that a sports car really encourages that since most real sports cars I see (vette's vipers, lambo's , ferraris, porsches) all drive safely while it's the schmucks in civics and infiniti G35s that are trying to take themselves out of the gene pool.

[henk4]

So is a hot hatch a sportscar?

Or for isntance, a BMW has excellent driving characteristics over, say a Renault. Would that count as a sportscar as well?

I see where you are coming from, but giving the universal praise the hot Megane versions get in the roadholding department, you comparison might not be totally correct. You could have used Citroen in stead as an example.
Anyway, I don't think it is a good idea to give a (any) BMW to a young driver, before subjecting them to a closed circuit test, with the ESP switched off, to learn them to control oversteer.

[TheScrutineer]

I think you can certainly call a FWD car sporty, and their of plenty of good handling FWD cars. In fact, I'm trading my BMW in for a Focus ST170 at the moment! Lets remember most of the field of the prestigious British Touring Car Championship are FWD cars.

However, being a massive RWD fan I would say that RWD is the true 'sports' configuration and any driving enthusiast should own a RWD car once in their life. I would never consider spending £10,000+ on anything FWD and with less than 200hp EVER! Unless I had kids.

*two years time in a Renault Scenic diesel with screaming kids in the back

Sorry to go off topic

[Ferrer]

I see where you are coming from, but giving the universal praise the hot Megane versions get in the roadholding department, you comparison might not be totally correct. You could have used Citroen in stead as an example.
Anyway, I don't think it is a good idea to give a (any) BMW to a young driver, before subjecting them to a closed circuit test, with the ESP switched off, to learn them to control oversteer.

I know hot Renaults are excellent, I just picked a brand at random.

What I meant is that for instance, in the BMW I can be inch perfect, especially at high speed. However it is a car that encourages you to drive fast. The Lancia is much less precise in that aspect, so it encourages you to drive slower. So in this case what would be the "safer" car for a young driver?

I agree completely on the closed racetrack lessons, they should be mandatory to have your license everywhere in the world in my opinion. I think that currently, at least here, they only teach you how to go from point A to point B without braking the law, they don't teach you how to drive.

PD I can relate to Scenic madness, I drove a Mk I 1.6 ages ago. It was fun, in a way...

[henk4]

I think that currently, at least here, they only teach you how to go from point A to point B without braking the law, they don't teach you how to drive.

Using the navigation system overhere has also become an intrinsic part of the drivers test....which of course is much more important than being able to handle a car.

[Ferrer]

Using the navigation system overhere has also become an intrinsic part of the drivers test....which of course is much more important than being able to handle a car.

What if you don't have satnav on your car...

I still remember a Top Gear episode where they showed that finnish learners were teaches to powerslide, brake and drive in difficult conditions before they were allowed on publics roads. That should be done everywhere.

[henk4]

What if you don't have satnav on your car...

Irrelevant, because you do not pass your exam in your own car.

[whiteballz]

That works two ways does it not? Over here you pass in your own vehicle.

[henk4]

That works two ways does it not? Over here you pass in your own vehicle.

how can you own/drive a vehicle if you don't have a license?

[whiteballz]

In australia we dont need an instructor to teach us, a documented amount of hours (varies state to state) with a fully licenced driver teaching you is all you need to pass your learners (as well as a final test with the tester)