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Thread: Toyota caught out cheating with their new Lexus IS-F racer

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by nota View Post
    Recent threads

    Toyota caught out cheating with their new Lexus IS-F racer

    Ex-head of Mitsubishi convicted for driver death in recall

    Toyota Australia reels from second engine blow

    TRD Aurion withdrawn from sale


    Anyone recognise a theme here?

    Let me guess.................ummmm all were true!!!!
    "As I walk through the valley of rice I shall fear no turbo, for torque art with me and the enemy is fat."

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by monaroCountry View Post
    Let me guess.................ummmm all were true!!!!
    When was Toyota caught cheating?
    If you should see a man walking down a crowded street talking aloud to himself, don't run in the opposite direction, but run towards him, because he's a poet. You have nothing to fear from the poet - but the truth.

    (Ted Joans)

  3. #18
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    1995 in WRC...lol
    University of Toronto Formula SAE Alumni 2003-2007
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by monaroCountry View Post
    Let me guess.................ummmm all were true!!!!
    What is up with you and Japanese cars? They're just as good and sometimes better than that Corvette you revere.

    (waits as he pulls out some conspiracy theory showing that Nissan lied about the GT-R)
    I'm dropping out to create a company that starts with motorcycles, then cars, and forty years later signs a legendary Brazilian driver who has a public and expensive feud with his French teammate.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wouter Melissen View Post
    When was Toyota caught cheating?
    ..and once again in Formula 1, 2 or 3 years ago...



    Quote Originally Posted by motorsportnerd View Post
    Is everyone aware that all cars in the DTM series run the same chassis/floorplan? With the body panels of the car they are supposed to represent drapped over the top?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
    It's a silhouette formula meaning that effectively all cars are raced under the same mechanical components with different bodies on top.
    ...erm, as far as I know, that's not the thruth about DTM-cars...!! (..and I just had a look on some rules and technical informations once again....)
    ..yes, there are a few parts, wich are all the same. (for example: gearbox, drive shaft, brakes, engine management or rear wing) BUT they all use there own chassis (rule: RWD chassis made of steel tubes with the silhouette of a four door road car) and even they've got their own engines (rule: V8 with 90 degrees angle, max. 4 litres capacity with max. 4 valves per cylinder).

    ..quite a funny thing, wich I didn't know: .even if the most body panels are made on carbon fibre, they've got to use the original roof panel of the road car for their silhouette...!



    Quote Originally Posted by Ferrer View Post
    It is. Altough the Seats have been close to beating them the last two seasons.
    ...and also the almost-Macau-winning-Alfa-Romeo and the Deawoo-renamed-Chevrolet...

  6. #21
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    You're embarassing yourself

  7. #22
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    but isn't Chevrolet the reigning Champion in WTCC....errr, no. BWM, Seat, then Chevy. sorry<G>

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by mac townsend View Post
    but isn't Chevrolet
    Corrected yourself ... minor other correction.

    Ray Mallock designed, built and run the team.
    They are also designing the new "Chevrolet"
    "A woman without curves is like a road without bends, you might get to your destination quicker but the ride is boring as hell'

  9. #24
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    This is like saying, Toyota in NASCAR taking a Ford car change body panels and calling it a Toyota? Just because the chassis, engine and mechanicals are controlled doesnt mean that its the same or that another manufacturer hasnt invested xxxx amounts in its development.
    "As I walk through the valley of rice I shall fear no turbo, for torque art with me and the enemy is fat."

  10. #25
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    NASCAR chassis are not "controlled" per se(which to my definition is designed and build by the same company for ALL to use). They have chassis rules, and aero templetes that each car from different manufacturers have to follow. Ford, GM, Dodge does not build any of these chassis or engine. They supply the engine blocks to engine builder who actually does their own R&D to get these engine to perform the way they do. Chassis also are built only by a few of the bigger teams. For Dodge there is Everham and such, Chevy there is Hendrick, DEI..., and Ford there is Roush. Toyota however uses TRD to build ALL of Toyota team's chassis and engine. They do their own development work, coordinate with the teams that runs them, and make improvement according their suggestion.
    University of Toronto Formula SAE Alumni 2003-2007
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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wouter Melissen View Post
    He posted this on another forum as well ... within a few posts the attention was turned to Audi, who actually race an engine that is based off a Mugen (Honda) design.

    Someone please PM QuattroMan and have him read this post!



  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by m&m-bravo View Post
    ...erm, as far as I know, that's not the thruth about DTM-cars...!! (..and I just had a look on some rules and technical informations once again....)
    ..yes, there are a few parts, wich are all the same. (for example: gearbox, drive shaft, brakes, engine management or rear wing) BUT they all use there own chassis (rule: RWD chassis made of steel tubes with the silhouette of a four door road car) and even they've got their own engines (rule: V8 with 90 degrees angle, max. 4 litres capacity with max. 4 valves per cylinder).

    ..quite a funny thing, wich I didn't know: .even if the most body panels are made on carbon fibre, they've got to use the original roof panel of the road car for their silhouette...!

    ...and also the almost-Macau-winning-Alfa-Romeo and the Deawoo-renamed-Chevrolet...

    OK, here's a link to the technical rules on the DTM website: www.dtm.com | Technisches Reglement. They are brief and do not mention who builds the chassis - just that they are "designed specifically for motorsport and is constructed around a steel space frame." I have a vague memory of an outside supplier (a racecar building company similar to Lola) supplying the manufacturers with the chassis each season - but I can't find any links or articles quickly to confirm my memory. I'll stand corrected if the manufacturers actually build their own chassis, but if they do that would seem to go against the "control" and "cost containment" goals of the series.

    Even if the manufacturer builds their own chassis, they are still based on very tight rules. As a design study and proposal, it would still make perfect sense for Toyota's motorsport division to buy an old DTM car, drap a Lexus body over it and present it to Toyota's board to show them that there are alternatives to F1. Not only that, it would allow TRD's engineers to get a handle on what is required to build an actual DTM car. And at a fraction of the cost of building a one off car just as a design and engineering study - so that if the proposed program isn't approved by the board, the amount spent is minimal.
    I'll state this clearly: there's no cheating go on. That car displayed at the Auto Salon hasn't raced as a Lexus and will not race as a Lexus.
    After all, if I go and buy an old DTM car and decide I'd prefer an Alfa body on it, spend the money and go and display the car at shows or even race it in other series, then how have I cheated? And should I acknowledge that my Alfa bodied DTM car actually originally raced as an Opel some 4 years ago?
    Besides, its only a rumour that this Lexus study was originally an old DTM car. That link on the autoblog page is hardly proof that this car is an old DTM Opel. And even if it is, so what? Only those people who really hate Japanese manufacturers will bother to claim that there's any cheating going on.
    Last edited by motorsportnerd; 01-23-2008 at 08:03 PM.
    UCP's biggest Ford Sierra RS500 and BMW M3 E30 fan. My two favourite cars of all time.

  13. #28
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    Theyre not cheating

    youre biased against anything japanese

    end of story.
    The Datto will rage again...

  14. #29
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    Best news thread EVAR!

  15. #30
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    So, does this mean that Lexus has gone away from Toyota and into the hands of GM? Or is copying the way they are becoming world no.1 in car sales?
    Signature removed, no spam allowed.

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