I imagine the plan behind using it was/is related to the alleged plan to use it in a car..? Or is my memory failing me again?
I-4
I-6
V-6
V-8
Box 4
Box 6
Don't know
I imagine the plan behind using it was/is related to the alleged plan to use it in a car..? Or is my memory failing me again?
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Wasn't it actually the other way round? That the rumors of road going Astons with straight sixes started because of the racing car?
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OK, I checked the link from RCE (and it looks like Sam used some of our pictures but not the one I attach here. It looks and it is being described as a semi stressed engine, whereby the struts connecting the tub and the gearbox take away lots of the load. From the looks of it would be actually quite easy to insert an inline four, if they want to go the turbo way.
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I thought the I-6 is Turbocharged? The spec I think was a direct injection 2 L turbo...As you noted with the 4 cylinder note, I wonder what they gain(if anything at all, aside from maybe "prestige" with 4 banger are more commonly associated in road car with econoboxes) from going the 6 cylinder route. 4 Cylinder turbo have been used throughout the ages in prototype racing, from the recent year's AER and Mazda motor to IMSA GTP's Toyota. The 2 extra cylinder buys you nothing but really more parts and more of a PITA to package....
The whole LMP engine topic makes me think about what a waste it is for the RS Spyder's engine being unused at this point.....Would make for a perfect petrol LMP1 motor in 2011 rule, being more powerful and capable of being fully stressed if the chassis is made for it compared to ARX-01e and the HPD 3.4V8. And its direct injected....
Last edited by RacingManiac; 05-10-2011 at 08:24 AM.
University of Toronto Formula SAE Alumni 2003-2007
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yes, the AMR is turbocharged, but the issue is why it should have six cylinders. A I4 turbo, such as the Mazda LMP2 from last years would be perfectly feasible.
I am sure somebody at Audi must have looked at using the Porsche engine in their prototype, but decided against it, as it would still no match for the diesels.
"I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams
Or more likely they just want to stick with the diesels for corporate marketing reasons....I am still unconvinced at the thought of diesel is the main reason why Audi/Peugeot are the dominant cars. You can't make that conclusion when no one is spending nearly the same ballpark of resources in a petrol car....
For that matter, no current petrol motor is remotely as good as the DI V8 from RS Spyder...and that car have beaten diesel Audi on Road America and Sebring outright...both of which are horsepower tracks....
University of Toronto Formula SAE Alumni 2003-2007
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www.fsae.utoronto.ca
An I6 engine has a balance advantage having no natural first or second harmonics in the crank/pistons. Saves designers having to have counter-balances ( saves weight in rotatig parts ) and dempeners.
"A woman without curves is like a road without bends, you might get to your destination quicker but the ride is boring as hell'
I am very curious why they decided to go I6 for this car. So far it looks like no one here really knows. Off the top of my head I can only throw out these common bits of knowledge.
1. 6 smaller cylinders typically will rev higher but have more friction than 4 larger ones.
2. An I6 is narrower but longer and less stiff than a V6. The V6 is also shorter.
However, perhaps AM thought the added length wasn't a problem and thought that the potentially negative engine tradoffs could be made up for via better chassis trade offs. Hard to say but often fascinating to hear why.
"I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting, but it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously." Douglas Adams
Another BIG plus in a sports/race car is the packaging.
By having non V then the engine is narrower. This will allow the suspension mounts to be further in board and have less camber change on compression, thus aiding the grip in cornering. As well as that they perhaps feel they can use the space created to improve the aero adn esp the underfloor flow exit ?
and yeah, as already covered in the "what's bad" on the I6, getting a block able to cope is difficult -- adn keep it light
Melling managed it in the AJP and he brought his bike design experience from on eof the best I4 suzuki engine designs
"A woman without curves is like a road without bends, you might get to your destination quicker but the ride is boring as hell'
Gearbox typically drives the suspension pickup(actually, its should be backward of that), not engine, provided that you have free reign in that aspect.....and further inboard pickup design does not automatically mean better camber control. And camber variation in bump does not always drive the design consideration(as you optimize that you are trading it off in roll). And having narrow inboard pickup in my experience gives you much worse roll center control. Interesting case in point in RS Spyder again:
Porsche RS Spyder Evo - High Resolution Image (11 of 24)
Note the upper A-arm actually picks up away from the actual gearbox casing and they purposely made a stand-off pickup point....its not hard to imagine it was meant for kinematic reason....
I did think AMR might be trying to use the narrow engine to do something similar to R15 did and utilize more "internal" aerodynamic. But the pictures thus far does not suggest that, and the fact that the layout dictates that you will have asymmetry in terms of plumbing for turbo-related items, its not exactly ideal....
University of Toronto Formula SAE Alumni 2003-2007
Formula Student Championship 2003, 2005, 2006
www.fsae.utoronto.ca
Yes, but if you want more stability and reduce caster change and toe-in/out with movemetn then you want to widen the A or introduce a forward pickup.
That engine has a V6, so no option to do it different
Also, gearboxes are getting smaller !!
But I do concur more liekly aero.
"A woman without curves is like a road without bends, you might get to your destination quicker but the ride is boring as hell'
That's correct only from a bending point of view. Inline engines are weaker when it comes to torsion and more at risk of facing resonance frequencies as soon as the pulse of the various forces acting on each piston/crank portion are close or equal to the natural pulse of the same part. Given the various harmonics all have the same phase, which is not that weird of a case.
Or perhaps I'm just too tired and shouldn't try to think about it now
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