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  #16  
Old 09-17-2009, 01:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wwgkd View Post
Given that there's a 400hp version naturally apirated out there already (granted a race engine, but it is fielded by lotus) and the fact that they're not trying to keep it in the cheaper toyota price bracket, do you really think they're going to go supercharged, or just stick with a hotter NA version?
the supercharged V6 is already in toyota's road cars and emission tested etc etc. would be a piece of cake to slot it in
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Originally Posted by wwgkd View Post
The decision to go with Toyota engines was largely involved in business. They have a deal with toyota, and they have to stick with it. I would have preferred a deal with honda, but what are you going to do?
same, i haven't been keeping track but i'm sure honda has some similarily good V6's. some people have converted their elises to K20's and the results are impressive, even if i can't see it being worth it lol.
at the end of the day, at least you know servicing costs and parts shouldn't be too bad
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  #17  
Old 09-17-2009, 04:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clutch-monkey View Post
the supercharged V6 is already in toyota's road cars
I did a quick search on the internet and found that the 3.5L Toyota V6 has about 315 HP. Is this correct? I suspect that if Lotus uses it, they would massage it to 350-400 hp, so that would require a separate testing / emission programme to be carried out.
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  #18  
Old 09-17-2009, 05:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightweight View Post
I did a quick search on the internet and found that the 3.5L Toyota V6 has about 315 HP. Is this correct? I suspect that if Lotus uses it, they would massage it to 350-400 hp, so that would require a separate testing / emission programme to be carried out.
The Aurion TRD had 325bhp and 400Nm. Maybe they'll use that as a base.
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  #19  
Old 09-17-2009, 05:26 AM
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i'm not 100% positive but that output might be limited due to the aurion being FWD

edit: 400nm is plenty..
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  #20  
Old 09-17-2009, 05:58 AM
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yeah, the toyota guys limited their output because of the FWD aspect IIRC.
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  #21  
Old 09-17-2009, 07:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightweight View Post
The Elise SC has a very simple bolt on Supercharger that does little to alter the dynamics of the chassis. If I remember correctly the difference in weight is 14 kg compared to the NA version.

That's probably the rationale behind the Evora Supercharged version. Avoid piping and cooling weight being placed all over the car, ruining the weight distribution.
sorry, i forgot to press my sarcasm button again. the Elise SC is very very good. it turned the Elise from a quick car that could handle, and a legitimately fast car that could handle.
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  #22  
Old 09-17-2009, 09:44 AM
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The Mazda AER MZR-R is only 74kg for 500hp. It just depends on how much you want to spend on an engine though. Toyota engines are not very expensive and Toyota has a really good name for dependability and availability for parts. I don't think using it as the base for their car is a bad idea at all.
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  #23  
Old 09-17-2009, 11:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightweight View Post
The Elise SC has a very simple bolt on Supercharger that does little to alter the dynamics of the chassis. If I remember correctly the difference in weight is 14 kg compared to the NA version.

That's probably the rationale behind the Evora Supercharged version. Avoid piping and cooling weight being placed all over the car, ruining the weight distribution.



Of course, Lotus being Lotus can make a LADA go fast, as Top Gear has proven. But that's not the point.
The weight of a supercharger or turbo or its piping, is not nearly as significant in the way it impacts a car than how the equipment delivers the requisite power. How that power is delivered is what affects the cars handling in addition to the weight of the equipment, if significant or if any. NA is still king in smooth and predictable power delivery, which is what you want in a curve or turns in a race.

A supercharger or turbo will deliver more torque, which can be very tricky to manage on curves and turns, if the car was not built and tested with the SC or turbo in mind. In fact, even with some cars that come with with SC and turbos, it can still be tricky to drive such cars in turns and curves. Just my opinion.

Last edited by G35COUPE; 09-17-2009 at 11:49 PM.
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  #24  
Old 09-18-2009, 01:25 AM
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Since basically every production supercharger is a positive-displacement job and generates near-max boost at idle, not an issue. And no, NA isn't always the best for delivery they can be very peaky.
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  #25  
Old 09-18-2009, 01:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G35COUPE View Post
The weight of a supercharger or turbo or its piping, is not nearly as significant in the way it impacts a car than how the equipment delivers the requisite power. How that power is delivered is what affects the cars handling in addition to the weight of the equipment, if significant or if any. NA is still king in smooth and predictable power delivery, which is what you want in a curve or turns in a race.
Let me clarify with an example:

The Exige has a supercharged 1.8 delivering 260 bhp. The equivalent NA motor would be a 2.5 liter engine, and probably a V6.

In terms of packaging I think that the Supercharged 1.8 I4 is far superior in terms of weight and the subsequent weight distribution. Of course the 2.5 V6 NA would be smoother, but overall I would assume that the Lotus choice is better.
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  #26  
Old 09-18-2009, 04:40 AM
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i always thought it was lotus who said in terms of performance the V6 is too middling to be any good and that a boosted I4 or a V8 was the way to go...probably thinking of a different company.. but i thought that was their rationale for not making more of those V6 sport exiges.
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  #27  
Old 09-18-2009, 04:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G35COUPE View Post
The weight of a supercharger or turbo or its piping, is not nearly as significant in the way it impacts a car than how the equipment delivers the requisite power. How that power is delivered is what affects the cars handling in addition to the weight of the equipment, if significant or if any. NA is still king in smooth and predictable power delivery, which is what you want in a curve or turns in a race.

A supercharger or turbo will deliver more torque, which can be very tricky to manage on curves and turns, if the car was not built and tested with the SC or turbo in mind. In fact, even with some cars that come with with SC and turbos, it can still be tricky to drive such cars in turns and curves. Just my opinion.
have you ever driven a supercharged car? it is just like an NA car, except with more power. turbos can hit hard, but superchargers rarely do.
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  #28  
Old 09-18-2009, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmcpokey View Post
have you ever driven a supercharged car? it is just like an NA car, except with more power. turbos can hit hard, but superchargers rarely do.
True. The Mini can pull from 30mph in sixth no problem at all.
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  #29  
Old 09-18-2009, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cmcpokey View Post
have you ever driven a supercharged car? it is just like an NA car, except with more power. turbos can hit hard, but superchargers rarely do.
exactly, driving a supercharged s2000 is wierd though.. like it has moar vtec, i dunno. it's as you say, like an N/A car, just... more.
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  #30  
Old 09-18-2009, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by clutch-monkey View Post
exactly, driving a supercharged s2000 is wierd though.. like it has moar vtec, i dunno. it's as you say, like an N/A car, just... more.
The S2000 is a peculiar case, being a 120 HP/liter motor, that employs pretty extreme valve timings to do so.

The Toyota V6 which we discuss now is way less than that, so once you accelerate, it will probably go
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