Hitler vs. Bush

[drakkie]

after some heavy debating i made this comparison:
http://www.ultimatecarpage.com/forum...6&postcount=37

when googling it I found out that not only I have this opinion !!! this really is a damn concerning thing.
http://semiskimmed.net/bushhitler.html
http://www.thepubliccause.net/Articl...StalinGOP.html

do americans feel this the same way, or are europeans beter informed, not having to see all the propaganda ?

[Rijoh]

You forgot the poll again Drakkie

[lightweight]

Well I have to say I'm not a fan of Bush, but I have to stress the following:
1. What he's doing favours his country (and at the same time does the opposite to other countries). Anyone in his place would have done the same thing. Just look at history. All powerful nations engaged wars. The most powerful nation will always do WTF they like.

2. US residents get all the US propaganda. But it is fair to say that European people get all the anti-Bush propaganda. Fair and Square.

[Wouter Melissen]

There might be similarities, but Bush is almost every aspect unlike Hitler. He may have started a war on unjustified grounds, but he did kick out a dictator and now attempts to set up a proper government, which if he pulls it off is a respectable job. Hitler on the other hand invaded numerous countries for his gain only and then set out an ethnic cleansing operation not seen since the Spanish Inquisition.

[drakkie]

2. US residents get all the US propaganda. But it is fair to say that European people get all the anti-Bush propaganda. Fair and Square.

i disagree on that with you.We also hear things he supposedly did right.however since we dont only hear good thngs, we can make a more balanced judgement.

[IWantAnAudiRS6]

I prefer Hitler's moustache. And I prerfer weevils over Bush. So Hitler it is. He also respected fine musicians...

[Matra et Alpine]

Well I have to say I'm not a fan of Bush, but I have to stress the following:
1. What he's doing favours his country (and at the same time does the opposite to other countries). Anyone in his place would have done the same thing. Just look at history. All powerful nations engaged wars. The most powerful nation will always do WTF they like.

Not ALL nations all the time.
Japan was economically the strongest nation and didnt' push nations around.
Britain has managed to allow nations under the "empire" to gain independance with dignity - took a few decades to get it right tho'
Iraq was ( in their eyes ) the most powerful nation in the region and they did it, but seem to get in lots of trouble for having doen so

2. US residents get all the US propaganda. But it is fair to say that European people get all the anti-Bush propaganda. Fair and Square.

Not really.
Being multi-cultural we are used to loking across many different views on the same point and reaching conclusions. This makes it VERY difficult for any media to dominate our cultures. So Italian TVs naked everything TV shows havent' taken up all TV slots across Eureop, France's open forum studio discussions with the public hasn't filled all our air time. ( Sadly British stuff like Graham Norton seems to get an audience in English-speeking countries )

This accepted multi-culturalism helps us inspect issues with more clarity IMHO. And multi-nationlaism makes us NOT be too partisan on our own leaders who we dont' hold as being "above" other citizens.

[drakkie]

There might be similarities, but Bush is almost every aspect unlike Hitler. He may have started a war on unjustified grounds, but he did kick out a dictator and now attempts to set up a proper government, which if he pulls it off is a respectable job. Hitler on the other hand invaded numerous countries for his gain only and then set out an ethnic cleansing operation not seen since the Spanish Inquisition.

do you call the killing of thousands of innocent people that mostly didn't even need/want war justified ?

Bush will probably get a lot richer after his retirement, cos of all the thank-you-for-letting-us-make-billions-of-the-war-gifts...

[Jack_Bauer]

So Italian TVs naked everything TV shows havent' taken up all TV slots across Eureop,

Give it time, Matra. Give it time!

[nota]

Current Iraq puppet-regime cannot rate as a 'proper' government imo. Likelyhood is, if Iraq were in fact to be allowed to regain self-determination through democracy, it'd promptly vote itself into religious fundamentalist rule

This represents something of a catch-22 for the Coalition's so-called 'liberators' doesn't it?

[Wouter Melissen]

do you call the killing of thousands of innocent people that mostly didn't even need/want war justified ?

Bush will probably get a lot richer after his retirement, cos of all the thank-you-for-letting-us-make-billions-of-the-war-gifts...

Thousands or millions, it's of course a subtle difference. I doubt these people were better off under the reign of one of the cruellest dictators of recent years. If anybody should be compared to Hitler, it's Saddam Hussein.

[lightweight]

i disagree on that with you.We also hear things he supposedly did right.however since we dont only hear good thngs, we can make a more balanced judgement.

Both US and European people get both opinions. It would be unrealistic to think otherwise. But in Europe, most reports on the subject are anti-Bush. On the other hand in the US, most reports favour Bush policy.
No-one gets 100% reports favouring one opinion. But MOST reports favour one opinion.

[lightweight]

Not ALL nations all the time.

I admit that I didn't know about the examples you mentioned. But I think it's obvious that the general trend is the following "I have more power, I can do things my own way". For sure there are exceptions throughout history, but most dominant nations/tribes did this.

The easy way is to go and make war.
The hard way is to negotiate through diplomacy
The most effective way is to conquer a country economically. In other words make others depend on you and then capitalize from this connection.

Not really.
Being multi-cultural we are used to loking across many different views on the same point and reaching conclusions. This makes it VERY difficult for any media to dominate our cultures. So Italian TVs naked everything TV shows havent' taken up all TV slots across Eureop, France's open forum studio discussions with the public hasn't filled all our air time. ( Sadly British stuff like Graham Norton seems to get an audience in English-speeking countries )

This accepted multi-culturalism helps us inspect issues with more clarity IMHO. And multi-nationlaism makes us NOT be too partisan on our own leaders who we dont' hold as being "above" other citizens.

I think that you are overestimating European people and on the same time underestimating US residents. That's fine with me, I'm European, but I don't agree.
US is multi-cultural also. Europe can't be considered as one nation. It's comprised of several countries that are culturally seperate. For sure there are multi-cultural nations in Europe, but I don't see how they differ to the ones in the US.

I love this kind of discussions!!!! Especially when people from other countries participate!!!!

[lightweight]

I have to report something that made a lasting impression to me.

It is NOT representative of the US public opinion, but shows a hint of the ignorance of the majority of US residents.

I had the chance to talk to a US student who was doing post-graduate studies in England. This person wasn't a fool, she could judge just like any other person, since she was doing her Master's Degree.
The discussion took place when the US was ready to invade in Iraq, but before doing so.
I asked her why do they have to invade Iraq.
The answer I got was: "We issued them an ultimatum ( a diplomatic paper telling Saddam to surrender or else...) and they didn't answer"

The fact that US didn't find any weapons of mass destruction wasn't even mentioned by her.

[emperor]

One major difference:
Hitler was inteligent and he was one hell of a good strategic leader (none of which I can say about Bush)