Sport Auto Super Test of ZR1

[wwgkd]

Yeah you raise a good point - I think I said the second point in a different way.

I guess it's fitting that a Jeep driver would take the supercar with the truck engine, isn't it?

lol. Never thought of it that way.

[Kitdy]

lol. Never thought of it that way.

You just imagine that engine in your Jeep, along with the adjustable wing that the ACR has gleaming proudly off the rear end of your whip.

[wwgkd]

You just imagine that engine in your Jeep, along with the adjustable wing that the ACR has gleaming proudly off the rear end of your whip.

You think you're joking but years ago I measured my jeep to see if there was any possible way it could fit in the engine bay or behind the drivers seat. Sadly no. Guess I have to stick with the 5.7 hemi.

[Kitdy]

You think you're joking but years ago I measured my jeep to see if there was any possible way it could fit in the engine bay or behind the drivers seat. Sadly no. Guess I have to stick with the 5.7 hemi.

What model and year is your Jeep anyways?

[Guibo]

How the hell can you win? So many car reviewers complain of dead on centre steering feel and then the ZR1 addresses this and is criticized?

They have improved the steering, but that does not mean it is yet the equal of rivals. The criticism raised by Sport Auto isn't just about the feel (read on)...

My point was that it's a bit paradoxical; the journalists bitch about lack of on centre feel then get it and bitch about it some more. It also seems as though it cost laptime but maybe not driving enjoyment? And truthfully, what's more important? I think I'd prefer a direct on centre steering feel anyways, and if it doesn't get the best laptimes who cares?

The Scuderia is more of a track car than the ZR1 and although it's down on power, it costs what, three times as much as the Corvette in North America? So the horsepower advantage that the Corvette has can be made up by all the fancy gadgetry, mid-engine design, and more advanced suspension set up of the much more expensive Ferrari.

Throw in a Scuderia though, and I think I'd risk being perceived as a badge whore and take it over the ZR1 and GT-R. No less, all three are exceptional machines.

One other thing about the Scuderia is that it has better aero development than the ZR1, which produces too much lift, and it's not well balanced front to rear.
The very fast steering of the ZR1 was beneficial on the Hockenheim club circuit; here it was easy to use the steering to control the rear end sliding, and as a result, the ZR1 posted a very excellent lap time of just 1:09.7. Hockenheim is smooth, flat, with good sightlines and safe run-off areas.
The faster Nurburgring has undulations, bumps, crests that coincide with turns, and much less runoff area. Here, you need a car that is stable, that instills supreme confidence. The ZR1's quick steering, which was an asset on the Hockenheim club circuit, now becomes a liability. It adds to the nervousness of the car, and consequently, less confidence for the driver to push as hard as he might otherwise. Combined with the uneven lift of the ZR1, and it becomes even more clear why it would not be faster; Sport Auto noted the ZR1 getting airborne in places and it was not balanced when it landed.

This is what people who were calling Nissan cheaters failed to realize: the Nordschleife is not like any other track. There's a whole littany of reasons as to why the GT-R might be more optimized for this track compared to other cars.

And no, you would not necessarily be a badge whore to pick the Scuderia over the ZR1 and GT-R.

As for bias in Sport Auto, it's perfectly possible. Their chief test driver for the supertests is a known Porsche fan, and their parent company Motor Presse is located in Stuttgart...

[henk4]

Are you sure you aren't letting your bias enter into your analysis henk? Your lack of appreciation of basically any American vehicle is well known.

Read my first post again. I explained that SA was very happy with the car apart from this steering issue. It is not MY analysis.

As far as the bias of the tester is concerned, Von Saurma has done more than 20 supertests with different Porsche models, so he knows that car very well. He may have problems with the ZR1 but that would also be valid for the GTR.

[Ferrer]

The Scuderia is more of a track car than the ZR1 and although it's down on power, it costs what, three times as much as the Corvette in North America? So the horsepower advantage that the Corvette has can be made up by all the fancy gadgetry, mid-engine design, and more advanced suspension set up of the much more expensive Ferrari.

The Corvette ZR1 isn't that cheap. At most the 430 Scuderia can be 50% more expensive, I think.

[henk4]

I think another part of the ringer issue was that the GT-R was the first in the new breed of ring wars to post times, and if you look at the cars specs it seems highly improbably. The ZR1 on the other hand has a much better power to weight so it seems more believeable.

Also, ACR FTW. That is all.

What I intended to say is that every time a new GTR laptime was announced there were those who did not believe it.
The factory (Magnussen) Z06 time was also not realised in the SA supertest and that now happened again with the ZR1 time. So continuing the good spirit of mistrust, I will call the GM factory cars "ringers"
And I think the GTR has proven that power to weight ratio is not the only thing that matters to achieve credible lap times.

[LeonOfTheDead]

Here I say it again, carbon fiber chassis. period.

[CapnBoost]

The specV has not been tested at the nurburgring. Nissan has been accused of using ringers, but no one (that i know of) has produced any evidence. GM itself was under fire when the "fastest four door sedan" was tested at the ring with what appears to be a roll cage.

As a result of having more rubber and less weight than the GTR, as well as the magneto-rheological suspension the ZR-1 posts a peak of about 1.6G (compared to 1.45G for the GTR) That being said, the GTR handles the faster corners better which lead to it's comparable times.

[LeonOfTheDead]

GM itself was under fire when the "fastest four door sedan" was tested at the ring with what appears to be a roll cage.

Thatw as because the lap time was achieved during the testing of the car.
Perhaps there was even the 70 kg ballast to simulate the passenger, as it usually is in endurance tests done at the Ring.
Do you remember if the roll cage was as large as the whole cabin, only the front seats or perhaps even just around the driver'

[CapnBoost]

Click for hueg picture. Other critics have claimed that the suspension may not be stock, given how compressed it appears at the bottom of the hill. The GM blog claims that it's a harness bar, installed for driver safety and in such a manner as not to enhance structural rigidity. But then, there is no third party to confirm... The sparco evo seat on the passenger side is probably not stock either.

HvS tests with a helmet and the car's passive restraints.

You just imagine that engine in your Jeep, along with the adjustable wing that the ACR has gleaming proudly off the rear end of your whip.

Jeep Wrangler Viper swap

[RacingManiac]

considering the car was at the bottom of a dip and in mid-corner, I'd say the suspension looks about normal....this is not a race car, nor does the suspension is designed for supporting downforce....find a pic of it cresting one of the many humps at Nordschleife I am sure you'll see tons of droop travel....

What was GM's claim for that car though(as in did they say its completely bone stock show room car?)? Its not unusual for a development car, even one thats basically production spec, to have safety equipment installed. 99% of the road car will never do this kind of driving, but for the tester/engineer, its their job to push a car on track, they need any safety they can get...a 4, 5 or 6point harness cannot be mounted without a bar behind the seat installed anyway, so its plausible to be a harness bar....

[CapnBoost]

I don't intend to suggest that it isn't plausible. But I do think that it's unreasonable for a manufacturer (or fans of a manufacturer) to claim that another company is fielding ringers when your own cars are pictured with non-stock parts clearly visible.

[G35COUPE]

I want a GTR in my drive way. That is all.