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  #1  
Old 07-20-2012, 04:41 AM
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2012 German Grand Prix (July 20 - 22)

McLaren have come to Germany with extensive updates and it paid off in the wet first practice session:

Quote:
Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Jenson Button McLaren-Mercedes 1m16.595 27
2. Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1m17.093s + 0.498 22
3. Fernando Alonso Ferrari 1m17.370s + 0.775 21
4. Michael Schumacher Mercedes 1m17.382s + 0.787 20
5. Sergio Perez Sauber-Ferrari 1m17.413s + 0.818 28
6. Nico Hulkenberg Force India-Mercedes 1m17.599s + 1.004 17
7. Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1m17.915s + 1.320 27
8. Felipe Massa Ferrari 1m17.995s + 1.400 22
9. Pastor Maldonado Williams-Renault 1m18.020s + 1.425 20
10. Romain Grosjean Lotus-Renault 1m18.130s + 1.535 21
11. Kamui Kobayashi Sauber-Ferrari 1m18.226s + 1.631 22
12. Sebastian Vettel Red Bull-Renault 1m18.339s + 1.744 21
13. Valtteri Bottas Williams-Renault 1m18.422s + 1.827 28
14. Daniel Ricciardo Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1m18.709s + 2.114 30
15. Kimi Raikkonen Lotus-Renault 1m18.831s + 2.236 14
16. Jules Bianchi Force India-Mercedes 1m18.972s + 2.377 21
17. Jean-Eric Vergne Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1m19.039s + 2.444 34
18. Vitaly Petrov Caterham-Renault 1m19.674s + 3.079 24
19. Heikki Kovalainen Caterham-Renault 1m19.963s + 3.368 24
20. Mark Webber Red Bull-Renault 1m20.122s + 3.527 27
21. Charles Pic Marussia-Cosworth 1m20.169s + 3.574 20
22. Timo Glock Marussia-Cosworth 1m20.539s + 3.944 18
23. Pedro de la Rosa HRT-Cosworth 1m21.138s + 4.543 24
24. Dani Clos HRT-Cosworth 1m21.740s + 5.145 27
Jenson Button quickest in rain-hit first practice for the German Grand Prix - F1 news - AUTOSPORT.com
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Old 07-20-2012, 11:06 PM
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Under scrutiny for his driving style during the race, Maldonado seems unaffected as he topped the equally wet second practice:

Quote:
Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Pastor Maldonado Williams-Renault 1m27.476 14
2. Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1m27.564s + 0.088 24
3. Sebastian Vettel Red Bull-Renault 1m27.902s + 0.426 24
4. Sergio Perez Sauber-Ferrari 1m28.402s + 0.926 26
5. Romain Grosjean Lotus-Renault 1m28.420s + 0.944 20
6. Nico Hulkenberg Force India-Mercedes 1m28.495s + 1.019 22
7. Daniel Ricciardo Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1m28.513s + 1.037 23
8. Jenson Button McLaren-Mercedes 1m28.516s + 1.040 16
9. Mark Webber Red Bull-Renault 1m28.877s + 1.401 21
10. Kimi Raikkonen Lotus-Renault 1m29.327s + 1.851 22
11. Jean-Eric Vergne Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1m29.364s + 1.888 26
12. Felipe Massa Ferrari 1m29.719s + 2.243 15
13. Kamui Kobayashi Sauber-Ferrari 1m29.785s + 2.309 24
14. Charles Pic Marussia-Cosworth 1m30.090s + 2.614 19
15. Timo Glock Marussia-Cosworth 1m30.220s + 2.744 16
16. Bruno Senna Williams-Renault 1m30.291s + 2.815 22
17. Heikki Kovalainen Caterham-Renault 1m30.331s + 2.855 26
18. Paul di Resta Force India-Mercedes 1m30.437s + 2.961 14
19. Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1m30.617s + 3.141 16
20. Fernando Alonso Ferrari 1m31.207s + 3.731 20
21. Vitaly Petrov Caterham-Renault 1m32.241s + 4.765 22
22. Narain Karthikeyan HRT-Cosworth 1m32.349s + 4.873 17
23. Michael Schumacher Mercedes 1m32.777s + 5.301 18
24. Pedro de la Rosa HRT-Cosworth 1m42.566s + 15.090 8

Pastor Maldonado tops second Friday practice for the German Grand Prix - F1 news - AUTOSPORT.com
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Old 07-21-2012, 03:50 AM
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Nico will have a five grid spot penalty.
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Old 07-21-2012, 03:54 AM
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The second practice wasn't equally wet, the times are ten seconds slower. Carefulness probably played a larger part than shear speed.
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Old 07-21-2012, 07:00 AM
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Quali, stuff, I'm still not a fan of Alonso, but geez that was good. Also seems to show up how much work McLaren have to do.
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Old 07-21-2012, 11:04 AM
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Alonso on pole again:

Quote:
Pos Driver Team Time Gap
1. Fernando Alonso Ferrari 1m40.621s
2. Sebastian Vettel Red Bull-Renault 1m41.026s + 0.405
3. Mark Webber Red Bull-Renault 1m41.496s + 1.838
4. Michael Schumacher Mercedes 1m42.459s + 2.880
5. Nico Hulkenberg Force India-Mercedes 1m43.501s + 3.329
6. Pastor Maldonado Williams-Renault 1m43.950s + 3.492
7. Jenson Button McLaren-Mercedes 1m44.113s + 3.565
8. Lewis Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1m44.186s + 0.875
9. Paul di Resta Force India-Mercedes 1m44.889s + 4.268
10. Kimi Raikkonen Lotus-Renault 1m45.811s + 5.190
Q2 cut-off time: 1m39.729s Gap **
11. Daniel Ricciardo Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1m39.789s + 2.424
12. Sergio Perez Sauber-Ferrari 1m39.933s + 2.568
13. Kamui Kobayashi Sauber-Ferrari 1m39.985s + 2.620
14. Felipe Massa Ferrari 1m40.212s + 2.847
15. Romain Grosjean Lotus-Renault 1m40.574s + 3.209
16. Bruno Senna Williams-Renault 1m40.752s + 3.387
17. Nico Rosberg Mercedes 1m41.551s + 4.186
Q1 cut-off time: 1m16.686s Gap *
18. Jean-Eric Vergne Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1m16.741s + 1.048
19. Heikki Kovalainen Caterham-Renault 1m17.620s + 1.927
20. Vitaly Petrov Caterham-Renault 1m18.531s + 2.838
21. Charles Pic Marussia-Cosworth 1m19.220s + 3.527
22. Timo Glock Marussia-Cosworth 1m19.291s + 3.598
23. Pedro de la Rosa HRT-Cosworth 1m19.912s + 4.219
24. Narain Karthikeyan HRT-Cosworth 1m20.230s + 4.537

Fernando Alonso grabs pole at wet Hockenheim ahead of German Grand Prix - F1 news - AUTOSPORT.com
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  #7  
Old 07-22-2012, 04:24 PM
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Pretty good race, Button v. Vettel was entertaining, not sure that I agree with Vettel's penalty, rules are rules I suppose but I don't think Vettel got an advantage by going wide in that turn.
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Old 07-22-2012, 07:14 PM
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He got the advantage by being able to go wide in that turn....he wouldn't have been able to accelerate past button if it were grass...or brake as late as he did without extra run-off...
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Old 07-22-2012, 10:46 PM
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Wasn't it this year also where a race in one of those Middle Eastern countries Hamilton also passed a driver outside the track and there was no penalty applied?

I'm not against such a penalty, but consistency would probably be better.
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Old 07-23-2012, 06:05 AM
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I think this vs Bahrain was not a fair comparison. That was on a straight, when Rosberg drove him off the road(not paved). In this case without the paved run off its doubtful Vettel would go as deep as he did, or wins the drag race off the corner on grass/gravel....
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:43 AM
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It isn't a fair comparison, but the section of track Rosberg drove Hamilton (and Alonso) off was paved, though a very different racing situation.
In this case as Button moved right in the DRS zone, Vettel passed on the left and was pushed deep into the corner by Button, who at mid corner provided no space to his left AT ALL. Vettel took the only option available... had the positions been reversed Button or any other racer would have done the same thing. While I appreciate the rule regarding passing off-track, the penalty was overly harsh. He should have been relegated one finishing place, not an additional 20 second dock on the timing sheet.

I was actually surprised by the podium comments from Niki Lauda, and expected a place penalty, not the added time.

Anyway, good on Alonso... he drove a great race and deserved the win.
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:29 PM
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I beg to differ^

Button was under no obligation to leave place on his left side, which Vettel should have taken into account when he started his highly optimistic move. The problem for Vettel was the inferior topspeed, even with DRS open, of the RB. I heard figures of 307 vs 318 kph. Vettel should simply have aborted his move or alternatively given up the place and try again.
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Old 07-23-2012, 12:38 PM
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I have to agree with Pieter, the backing off option is always there (also in Hamilton/Alonso/Rosberg case), and anyway it seemed like Vettel had a clearly faster car so if he had been patient it would have probably been just a matter of time.

It's also quite amazing how Ferrari's fortunes have changed since the start of the season (it has to be said, in no small part due Alonso's talent).
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Old 07-23-2012, 08:17 PM
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I beg your pardon, and agree after seeing the overhead images. Found good screen grabs of the pass, but most are the wrong format (PNG) to post here. Of course Button wasn't obligated to make it easy, that's not what I meant. But clearly the race video angle looked different than the stills, which show enough space for Vettel had he simply put two wheels off and made it stick. His fault for not doing so.

They clearly show Vettel alongside Button which in the foreshortened video was the basis of my original opinion. As I said, I've no issues with the penalty, though the additional 20 seconds still seems harsh to me. BTW... regarding the whine about Hamilton unlapping himself on Vettel, that was just silly. Hamilton pulled it fairly and never hindered Vettel.
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Last edited by csl177; 07-23-2012 at 08:19 PM.
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Old 07-23-2012, 09:55 PM
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I think Vettel would not have had the speed to put only two wheels off the track. And the picture cleaarly shows that he is still behind Button.

perhaps whining is Vettel's second nature.
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