2010 Monaco Grand Prix (May 13 - 16)

[RacingManiac]

That was one of the specific rule change this year, same reason how Hamilton passed Webber in China. They have a line on the track that's effectively the "start racing" line that the passing should be allowed.

[RacingManiac]

http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/65EE8F15945D0941C12576C7005308AE/$FILE/1-2010%20SPORTING%20REGULATIONS%2010-02-2010.pdf

Rules seems contradictory...

40.13 is the one I think he got penalized with....though 40.4 mention the board and yellow flag will be shown in SC period.
ie:

2009 Australian GP

In this case that was not the case....

[henk4]

what is the penalty?

[twinspark]

I was watching the BBC broadcast, and they seemed very convinced that there's a rule concerning the last lap under SC, where passing wouldn't be allowed even if the SC comes in (yes, it wouldn't be the best rule but rules are rules). Domenicali was sure that this was absolutely clear to every team boss, but he's heavily biased of course.

So I wonder what the rulebook says about green flags in that situation. Are they supposed to be up? Does the no passing rule still stand?

If the rules are unclear, then I respect Schumi's sly move, but if they're clear on the subject, then I think the penalty was right. Mercedes will appeal of course, after which I'm sure the FIA will end up with the right solution. There's nothing unclear about the evidence.

Edit: too slow

[RacingManiac]

There is a precedence of the cars being shown yellow and SC board for the end of race thing, but procedurally this time looks different....I have a feeling it might be an race control error....

[twinspark]

I have a feeling it might be an race control error....

That would be my guess too. In which case I think the best solution would be to return Schumacher between Alonso and Rosberg. If that's even possible by the rules, a 0.3 second penalty would be a bit silly. Anyway, 20 seconds seems excess.

[ringle]

Bernie's favorite story-line plays out again, this time in the magic kingdom of the rich and famous..."Any press (for F1) is good press!"

...and the F1 Circus rolls on!

[pimento]

'Tis a shame that this one little move is overshadowing the rest of the results.. but then, it was one of the few things that happened in the race. For the record I think Schumi's in the right.. it seems to me to be another case of rules being too vague and easily misinterpreted. I'da thunk the race should have ended under yellow flags to confirm the no overtaking thing. Still, another dominating performance by Webber, so I'm obviously happy about that.

[Matra et Alpine]

Let's repeat.
The TRACK WAS CLEARED and so by the rules of racing the safety car is called in.
It happens to be the last lap, but that shouldn't affect the decision on the SC as it must always be decided on ONLY the clear or not clear of the track.
To ask for a special rule for the last lap imo woudl be a travesty of racing.
We WANT cars racing and overtaking, so why come up with a special rule to prevent it ?
To return to green is NOT any more unsafe to do in the last lap as it is in the first and any argument that it is I dont' see stands on any logic.
It would be a terrible decision to make last lap a special case, we dont' WANT any additional yellow flag laps in real racing, lets leave that for NASCAR

THe ONLY problem here was Alonso and the Ferrari teams were dicks and called it wrong to the drivers. NO WAY should the rules be changed because some team act like amateurs , nor should Schumi be punished.

Let's be clear, now that it has happened it will be interesting to see how they reword the rules or provide addendum to explain why the intepretation will now be different from the English originaly in the regs If it had been left as is, then all learned the lesson to read and understand the rules better. What will it be next ? Ferrari forget to put a wheel on and complain that the regs dont' make it clear so they shodul be given points ????

Of course, the alternative is that the regulation authors admit they screwed it up and SHOUDL have put a clause in making it clear last lap was meant to be special. For me, same rule as above should apply

[LeonOfTheDead]

Out of curiosity, why was the new rule (SC line) introduced?

[wwgkd]

Let's repeat.
The TRACK WAS CLEARED and so by the rules of racing the safety car is called in.
It happens to be the last lap, but that shouldn't affect the decision on the SC as it must always be decided on ONLY the clear or not clear of the track.
To ask for a special rule for the last lap imo woudl be a travesty of racing.
We WANT cars racing and overtaking, so why come up with a special rule to prevent it ?
To return to green is NOT any more unsafe to do in the last lap as it is in the first and any argument that it is I dont' see stands on any logic.
It would be a terrible decision to make last lap a special case, we dont' WANT any additional yellow flag laps in real racing, lets leave that for NASCAR

THe ONLY problem here was Alonso and the Ferrari teams were dicks and called it wrong to the drivers. NO WAY should the rules be changed because some team act like amateurs , nor should Schumi be punished.

Let's be clear, now that it has happened it will be interesting to see how they reword the rules or provide addendum to explain why the intepretation will now be different from the English originaly in the regs If it had been left as is, then all learned the lesson to read and understand the rules better. What will it be next ? Ferrari forget to put a wheel on and complain that the regs dont' make it clear so they shodul be given points ????

Of course, the alternative is that the regulation authors admit they screwed it up and SHOUDL have put a clause in making it clear last lap was meant to be special. For me, same rule as above should apply

You keep bring up NASCAR, but they actually extend the race for up to 9 laps to try and end under green.

Out of curiosity, why was the new rule (SC line) introduced?

People hate a slow parade across the finish line would be my guess.

[pimento]

I'd say the line isn't for last lap SC stuff but for more opportunity to pass under a restart. By the time they get to the S/F line it's too late for a fast charging restart, but at that SC line stuff like this can happen. The problem with this is the wording about the last lap being finished under SC.. the debate is whether or not this race was. I believe it wasn't due to the waved greens but maybe race control stuffed up and should have kept the yellows out. Regardless, greens were waved.. so to me that means race on for the last corner.

[Rockefella]

It's no surprise that the most interesting portion of thr grand prix is the legality of Schumacher's pass over Alonso. I used to be F1 crazed and would watch it live at obscene hours of the night. Now I barely watch it in my free time on the DVR.

[twinspark]

Let's repeat.
The TRACK WAS CLEARED and so by the rules of racing the safety car is called in.
It happens to be the last lap, but that shouldn't affect the decision on the SC as it must always be decided on ONLY the clear or not clear of the track.
To ask for a special rule for the last lap imo woudl be a travesty of racing.
We WANT cars racing and overtaking, so why come up with a special rule to prevent it ?
To return to green is NOT any more unsafe to do in the last lap as it is in the first and any argument that it is I dont' see stands on any logic.
It would be a terrible decision to make last lap a special case, we dont' WANT any additional yellow flag laps in real racing, lets leave that for NASCAR

THe ONLY problem here was Alonso and the Ferrari teams were dicks and called it wrong to the drivers. NO WAY should the rules be changed because some team act like amateurs , nor should Schumi be punished.

Let's not distort things. This isn't about Ferrari or Alonso asking for a special rule, the regulations state that "if the race ends whilst the safety car is deployed it will enter the pit lane at the end of the last lap and the cars will take the chequered flag as normal without overtaking".

Then again "when the green lights are illuminated the safety car will leave the grid with all cars following in grid order no more than ten car lengths apart. During a race start there will be no formation lap and race will start when the green lights are illuminated".

Regardless of what you may think of Ferrari, any of the teams would have complained in their position, because there's a rule to back up the complaint. Same goes for Mercedes and the other rule. Why is nobody bashing them for ignoring the 40.13 (except for the stewards)? Because they did something entertaining, and they are not Ferrari.

It's no surprise that the most interesting portion of thr grand prix is the legality of Schumacher's pass over Alonso.

Interesting ≠ controversial.

[Wouter Melissen]

The race did not end under the safety car. The safety car situation ends as soon as green flags are shown and they were.